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David Price

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Re: David Price

Postby AllDay » Mon Apr 06, 2009 6:37 am

I've read 6 weeks is the time line.

I'm not a DRay fan though, and I'm sure need and his success would be obvious factors as well.

I'm keeping him. I've got a lot of youth on my team and I need him and/or others to perform to lofty expectations or I could be in real trouble with some of my pitching.
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Re: David Price

Postby SignGuy » Wed Apr 08, 2009 1:19 pm

Does anyone know the exact date when he can come up and not have his clock pushed forward? Unless he struggles in AAA i dont see why they keep him down for longer than that. I know Wieters can come up around the 19th or so and was wondering if Price's is that soon as well
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Re: David Price

Postby AndrewKrylon » Wed Apr 08, 2009 2:42 pm

Sucks if he's on your fantasy team, but I think it's a sound decision if you're in the Rays organization. Kid has got a great arm, and once his breaking stuff is sharper, he'll be an ace.
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Re: David Price

Postby Curtis Pride » Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:00 pm

SignGuy wrote:Does anyone know the exact date when he can come up and not have his clock pushed forward? Unless he struggles in AAA i dont see why they keep him down for longer than that. I know Wieters can come up around the 19th or so and was wondering if Price's is that soon as well


There isn't an exact date. The Super 2 date is determined at the end of the year based on when he got called up in relation to when everyone else got called up. It's something like the earliest 15% of players will qualify early.

It's typically around late May/Early June that teams wait to bring up their prospects in order to ensure that they won't hit the arbitration cutoff date.
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Re: David Price

Postby SignGuy » Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:16 pm

Curtis Pride wrote:
SignGuy wrote:Does anyone know the exact date when he can come up and not have his clock pushed forward? Unless he struggles in AAA i dont see why they keep him down for longer than that. I know Wieters can come up around the 19th or so and was wondering if Price's is that soon as well


There isn't an exact date. The Super 2 date is determined at the end of the year based on when he got called up in relation to when everyone else got called up. It's something like the earliest 15% of players will qualify early.

It's typically around late May/Early June that teams wait to bring up their prospects in order to ensure that they won't hit the arbitration cutoff date.


Thanks. Do i have it wrong then that Wieters can come up as early as the 19th and not gain Super 2 status? I can't remember where i read that, i'll try and find the link
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Re: David Price

Postby Curtis Pride » Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:28 pm

http://mlbplayers.mlb.com/pa/info/faq.jsp

Q: When does a player become eligible for salary arbitration?
A: A player with three or more years of service, but less than six years, may file for salary arbitration. In addition, a player can be classified as a "Super Two" and be eligible for arbitration with less than three years of service. A player with at least two but less than three years of Major League service shall be eligible for salary arbitration if he has accumulated at least 86 days of service during the immediately preceding season and he ranks in the top 17 percent in total service in the class of Players who have at least two but less than three years of Major League service, however accumulated, but with at least 86 days of service accumulated during the immediately preceding season.


it's top 17% of players in that class. So really, it's not known for three years exactly whether he will be super 2 or not. If I recall, Manny Delcarmen missed it by one day for the Red Sox last year. But it's not something that they can set with any level of specificity - or else every team would just wait until that day to bring up prospects.

I think the date you have is incorrect.
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Re: David Price

Postby SignGuy » Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:00 pm

This from the Baltimore Sun:

The move is both strategic and economic. The club wants to give Wieters the chance to excel at the Triple-A level the way he did at Single-A Frederick and Double-A Bowie. ... Wieters needs to stay in the minors for the first 12 days of the regular season to keep the free-agent clock ticking for an extra year, but team officials have indicated he'll probably play at Norfolk for a month or two to get more professional experience before moving permanently into the major league lineup.



[url]
http://sports.yahoo.com/fantasy/blog/ro ... asy,151113[/url]
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Re: David Price

Postby SignGuy » Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:03 pm

This gives some clarification as well.

How long does he need to stay in the minors as to the Orioles maximizing their control once his clock starts?



He needs to stay down only about two weeks -- so that he's below 175 days in the majors this season -- to delay free agency until after 2015.

Super Two-dom is more of a floating target, but he'd need to stay down for roughly two months to delay arbitration eligibility until after 2012.
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Re: David Price

Postby deerayfan072 » Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:20 pm

IMO, the move with Price has less to do with control over arbitration and everything to do with controling his innings this year. They have said that is the reason they are doing this and have not budged from that. Last year they sent Evan down and everyone said it was to hold his clock back, and yet they signed him to a deal through his arbitration a few days after he was called up. They had been working on that deal while he was in the minors. The Rays have always been very cautious with there arms and I think that is what they are doing here. They can pull him from AAA games in the 5th innning even if they are in a close game and he is pitching well in order to save his number of innings. You couldn't do that in the bigs. The rays have staunchly stayed to their formula of only letting a pitcher throw something like 20% more pitches each season. (I think it is 20, it could be less) They feel that is how you bring a young pitcher along and will stick to it. He will be up, and when he does it will be for good.
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Re: David Price

Postby Curtis Pride » Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:39 pm

SignGuy wrote:This gives some clarification as well.

How long does he need to stay in the minors as to the Orioles maximizing their control once his clock starts?



He needs to stay down only about two weeks -- so that he's below 175 days in the majors this season -- to delay free agency until after 2015.

Super Two-dom is more of a floating target, but he'd need to stay down for roughly two months to delay arbitration eligibility until after 2012.

As foolish as it is for me to say I'm right and a giant paper like the Baltimore sun is wrong, I think they are.

The MLB rules pretty explicitly say "top 17%" There is nothing anywhere about 175 days. I find it hard to believe that 17% of players called up will be called up in the first two weeks of the season. If we look back at history, we see guys like Lincecum, Hamels, Braun, Bruce, Pence at all get called up soemtime in May and "delay their arbitration" is always an excuse used.

if we assume that the distribution of when most players get called up is pretty even, then we can assume that the cutoff will be around 17% of the way into the season. And that would be a little more than a month into the season. Which is pretty well aligned with the recent history of elite prospects not getting called up until mid-late May.
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