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Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

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Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby bspel55 » Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:12 pm

I'm getting tired of the 5x5 and I would like a deep league. Its a roto league and I'm the commish every year.

Here's what I have so far, looking for where to expand without opening the door for people to punt categories, especially in pitching because the people in my league are the kind of people that will do that.

Anyway heres what I have:

Batting: R/Hits/HR/RBI/SB/Walks/BA
Pitching: W/SV/K/ERA/WHIP/QS/need one more...

The other option I guess would be to drop hits and walks and do OBP, but I'd really like to do as deep as I can get away with. Thanks for the help, if you need help leave a link and I'll help you.
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby baizboll » Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:31 pm

How about slugging pct, OPS, or total bases as a sub for walks and/or hits. For pitching you could use holds, losses, or one of the ratios, e.g. K/9 or K/W, etc.
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby Curtis Pride » Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:40 pm

why not just R, RBI, HR, SB, BA, OPB, SLG.

That will largely increase the value of guys like Dunn and kill the value of Pierre (as well it should be).

You could also do net steals (SB-CS) instead of steals.
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby DM311 » Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:42 pm

I host a 5x5 league as well and plan on expanding, adding in OPS but not sure what is the best stat to balance pitching. What do most people use for 6x6 or higher?
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby Curtis Pride » Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:47 pm

Just add QS and Holds to the existing 5x5 structure. One helps starters, once helps middle relievers. Of course both kill the value of closers, so be ware.

Every time there's a thread of "fixing" the "boring 5x5" categories, it turns out that the reason 5x5 is so standard, is because it's the best format. Everything else ends up weighing too much on one type of player.
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby walkoffblast » Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:59 pm

How is 5x5 the best? Over 20 percent of a players is total stolen bases. That is pretty far removed from reality. None of the standard 5 offensive categories are especially good at predicting talent over luck/opportunity. The 7x7 listed above is really good but that 7th pitching category is tough to not make redundant. In roto qs works reasonably well. Holds is not a particularly great stat but it is what you are looking for. It expands the player pool which is nice.
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby Trojan Pony » Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:03 pm

What about...

R/XBH/RBI/SB/AVG/OPS

W/SV/HD/K/ERA/WHIP

I'm toying with doing that in a league right now... XBH will boost the value of double hitters who have good pop but not necessarily home run power and good runners who don't necessarily steal a lot of bases. I think both groups are currently undervalued in most fantasy leagues. The use of OPS instead of OBP would mean power hitters still have significant value, despite the lack of HR as a stand-alone category.

I was reluctant to add Holds as I don't want to devalue Closers but I think Holds are spread out enough among a wide enough field of players, and unpredictable enough, that Closers would still be considerably more valuable than the vast majority of Holds guys.

I don't like K/BB because it correlates WAY too much to WHIP. If you use K/BB you gotta get rid of WHIP. I'd rather just stick with WHIP.

I don't like K/9 because if you already have K's, you're basically counting them twice and further boosting the value of flamethrowers and decreasing the value of control pitchers, who I think are already undervalued in most fantasy leagues.

I don't like having Wins AND QS... too redundant. Should be one or the other I think.

Not sure how I feel about Losses... I guess I just feel like Wins are already enough of a crapshoot as it is and can be very frustrating, why compound that by adding Losses? I suppose if you had QS and Losses that kind of makes sense since you would protect against the common mediocre start that registers as a QS but doesn't get the job done for the W. But if you're adding that many SP-centric categories, you need to add one or two more to boost relievers... Argh!

I dunno... I've had a hard time finding anything beyond 6x6 that really makes sense...
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby pepsi020874 » Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:33 pm

All I can say that I have had success with and is fun because alot of hitters do it is SAC Flys. Its a great Cat
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby rounders2080 » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:09 pm

I'm the commissioner of a league and we've had the same 7x7 categories since 2003. It's worked well, except we have one guy in the league that makes about 200 transactions per season and has won our Yahoo H2H league (14 managers minimum) the past 3 seasons. He churns thru SPs on a daily basis and somehow has time to do this regularly. He doesn't draft any good SPs.. he loads up on offense and top closers.

Current 7x7 categories:
Offense - R, HR, RBI, SB, K (least), AVG, and OPS
Pitching - W, SV, K, HR (least), ERA, HLDS, and WHIP

Because of this one manager... the other managers in the league are getting upset and I'm now having guys drop out of the league b/c this guy basically has "beaten the system". Since the league does NOT want to add in any type of transactions fees, we're going to go to an 8x8 league... in the hope that things even out more.
One stat that I'm definitely going to add for Pitching is "Losses". Hopefully, this will prevent managers from churning thru dozens of average/below average SP's.

My problem is that I now need to add in a new offensive category, but I dont' know which one. We're considering Total Bases, Errors, Caught Stealing, and whatever else might work well. I dont' want to add a category like Hits, which is kind of already spoken for in AVG. Does anyone have any good suggestions ? I've already had a few guys shut down the idea of Errors.. which I understand.
Last edited by rounders2080 on Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Looking for balanced categories, 7x7 or higher

Postby RDD15 » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:21 pm

Rounders,
A transaction limit, or more traditional in a roto, innings pitched limit, is in order for your league. If either of those are not implemented, then the rest of the owners in your league need to beat this guy at his own game.

For the OP, you say you want to discourage punting categories. First, why? It is a legitimate strategy in Roto. It isn't cheap. The guys in your league that are the type of guys that would do that are the type of guys smart enough to try to maximize what they can get out of a rules system.

Second, if you insist on punting being evil, then the more categories you add, the more viable punting will become to these guys.
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