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Town Hall debate

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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby jfg » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:28 pm

Ok, I guess I just don't get the choice then. McCain should appeal to the Christian right as well, other than his unclear stance on women's rights. So, I guess my questions are, with the ability to pick any pro-life candidate, why Palin, and why did the Christian right applaud the choice? Because the candidate wasn't Mormon or Jewish? I guess that would make a little more sense.
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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby Amazinz » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:43 pm

McCain alienated the Christian right when he ran against Bush. That's why McCain worked so hard to repair that relationship this time around. I guess that aligning with Palin helped heal those wounds.
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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby Yoda » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:46 pm

Amazinz wrote:McCain alienated the Christian right when he ran against Bush. That's why the GOP worked so hard to repair that relationship this time around. I guess that aligning with Palin helped heal those wounds.


Fixed.
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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby knapplc » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:51 pm

I think the Palin nod had very little to do with Christian ideology. The fact that she is Christian AT ALL was enough.

Just because a voter is Christian does not mean that he can't be swayed by a pair of pretty legs. It's been known to happen before, people being human and all.

Condy Rice, Elizabeth Dole, Kay Hutchinson and Olympia Snowe are all Christians. Why not pick them? Each has more experience on the national stage than Palin.

This was a very calculated move, and it has everything to do with Palin's looks.
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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby Neato Torpedo » Fri Oct 10, 2008 9:19 pm

Amazinz wrote:In order to understand why she would be attractive to the Christian right (not all of the Christian right is evangelical) then you need to look at the social issues that are important to them. But you referred to a mandate on creationism taught in public schools. The Christian right doesn't want this. I am sure there are some radicals that do but this type of stuff is more in line with the caricature painted by some liberals.

Next, Carey asked about teaching alternatives to evolution - such as creationism and intelligent design - in public schools. […]

Palin: “Teach both. You know, don’t be afraid of information.

Healthy debate is so important and it’s so valuable in our schools. I am a proponent of teaching both.

And, you know, I say this, too, as the daughter of a science teacher. Growing up with being so privileged and blessed to be given a lot of information on, on both sides of the subject — creationism and evolution.

It’s been a healthy foundation for me. But don’t be afraid of information and let kids debate both sides.”


That said, it's REALLY hard to find unbiased sources to talk about Palin's stance on ID, the only source I can trust to be unbiased from what I saw on Google in a quick search was a direct quote. But still, I'd like to see some evidence to the contrary.
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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby jfg » Fri Oct 10, 2008 9:37 pm

That's about what I figured her stance was and it's in line with most conservative Christians. The problem with that thinking is that there is no scientific evidence that there is a god so it has no place being debated in a science class. At least there are some scientific findings that support evolution even though it shouldn't be taught as hard fact. I'm for a mandatory religion class in public schools where major religions are studied and kids learn about the traditions and teachings of various religions. But, I have a feeling many Christians would be against a class like that.
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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby Neato Torpedo » Fri Oct 10, 2008 10:15 pm

jfg wrote:That's about what I figured her stance was and it's in line with most conservative Christians. The problem with that thinking is that there is no scientific evidence that there is a god so it has no place being debated in a science class. At least there are some scientific findings that support evolution even though it shouldn't be taught as hard fact. I'm for a mandatory religion class in public schools where major religions are studied and kids learn about the traditions and teachings of various religions. But, I have a feeling many Christians would be against a class like that.

Teach them this: http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/dinos.shtml

Unfortunately, our public school system and the media have convinced us that dinosaurs were extinct at least 60 million years before man appeared on earth. They have done such a good job in this area that we can not imagine people and dinosaurs living at the same time. The fact is that dinosaurs were created no more than one day before mankind, not many millions of years earlier—and we have evidence to support that statement.


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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby Amazinz » Fri Oct 10, 2008 10:25 pm

FactCheck.org wrote:On Aug. 29, the Boston Globe reported that Palin was open to teaching creationism in public schools. That's true. She supports teaching creationism alongside evolution, though she has not actively pursued such a policy as governor.

In an Oct. 25, 2006, debate, when asked about teaching alternatives to evolution, Palin replied:

Palin, Oct. 25, 2006: Teach both. You know, don't be afraid of information. Healthy debate is so important and it's so valuable in our schools. I am a proponent of teaching both. And you know, I say this too as the daughter of a science teacher. Growing up with being so privileged and blessed to be given a lot of information on, on both sides of the subject – creationism and evolution. It's been a healthy foundation for me. But don't be afraid of information and let kids debate both sides.

A couple of days later, Palin amended that statement in an interview with the Anchorage Daily News, saying:

Palin, Oct. 2006: I don't think there should be a prohibition against debate if it comes up in class. It doesn't have to be part of the curriculum.

After her election, Palin let the matter drop. The Associated Press reported Sept 3: "Palin's children attend public schools and Palin has made no push to have creationism taught in them. ... It reflects a hands-off attitude toward mixing government and religion by most Alaskans." The article was headlined, "Palin has not pushed creation science as governor." It was written by Dan Joling, who reports from Anchorage and has covered Alaska for 30 years.


As for a religion class, I would not personally be against a class like that although I do think it could be can of worms. I also think you'd have trouble finding someone qualified enough to teach this type of class at the pre-college level. Most colleges have intro to religion type classes that are geared in this manner taught by theologians.
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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby Neato Torpedo » Fri Oct 10, 2008 10:57 pm

^^^Fair enough. Even that direct quote was biased, as it was taken out of context. :-/
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Re: Town Hall debate

Postby jfg » Sat Oct 11, 2008 1:02 am

Amazinz wrote:
As for a religion class, I would not personally be against a class like that although I do think it could be can of worms. I also think you'd have trouble finding someone qualified enough to teach this type of class at the pre-college level. Most colleges have intro to religion type classes that are geared in this manner taught by theologians.


I think it would be just like any other class teaching from a textbook- basic stuff. You wouldn't really need a theology professor to teach it. But, I think learning about different religions in 11th-12th grade is more important than reading Shakespeare.
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