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Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

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Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby thatguy27 » Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:57 pm

With the years that Kinsler and Utley are having, it's very possible that both MVPs this season could second basemen.

It wouldn't surprise me, however, if Hamilton were to win it over Kinsler, assuming he keeps up his pace. But I'm not so sure that Kinsler isn't more deserving at this point.

Have both MVPs ever been second basemen before?
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby DSheppard » Sun Jul 13, 2008 4:49 pm

i think kinsler is more deserving than hamilton at this particular moment.

however I dont think either will win it unless the rangers can gain more ground on the angels. i doubt this is an a-rod year where noone on a contender is close.
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby Grounded Polo » Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:17 pm

Hamilton has 40 more RBIs than Kinsler, it's not even close for who is the most valuable player on the Rangers honestly, even if Kinsler is having a great year. Any guy who can seemingly reach 150 RBIs half asleep now is a real candidate even if his team isn't that great.
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby Steelers Rule » Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:20 pm

DSheppard wrote:i think kinsler is more deserving than hamilton at this particular moment.

however I dont think either will win it unless the rangers can gain more ground on the angels. i doubt this is an a-rod year where noone on a contender is close.

kinsler is more deserving than hamilton :-X
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby DSheppard » Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:01 pm

Grounded Polo wrote:Hamilton has 40 more RBIs than Kinsler, it's not even close for who is the most valuable player on the Rangers honestly, even if Kinsler is having a great year. Any guy who can seemingly reach 150 RBIs half asleep now is a real candidate even if his team isn't that great.



They are two sides of the same coin, just at different lineup spots. Kinsler is a leadoff hitter with a .397 obp, a lot of extra base hits and 23 steals. This has a huge impact on how many rbis hamilton has. On the flipside, kinsler in his own right is on pace for a ridiculous 144 runs, with the same credit due to hamilton/bradley. They are both good in each category on their own, but have helped eachother into the next level.

And kinsler is on pace for 99 rbis, not exactly poor for a leadoff hitter.
He also leads hamilton in .ops, .945 to .919.

Kinsler leads the american league in batting average, hits, runs, total bases and extra base hits. He is top 7 in slugging, on base percentage and steals.

Hamilton has been awesome, but RBIs are his only one truly standout MVP type number and its the stat most dependant on your lineup.

A case can certainly be made for hamilton and I think he will be better post ASB than he was before it (aside from rbis), but you cant dismiss kinsler because a leadoff hitter cant stack up to a middle of the order hitter in rbis.
Last edited by DSheppard on Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby Yoda » Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:31 pm

If the MVP voting were today then Kinsler deserves it. He is beating Hamilton in VORP, RC and WS but he's been really hot lately whereas Hamilton's been more consistent this year.
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby Snakes Gould » Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:49 pm

DSheppard wrote:
Grounded Polo wrote:Hamilton has 40 more RBIs than Kinsler, it's not even close for who is the most valuable player on the Rangers honestly, even if Kinsler is having a great year. Any guy who can seemingly reach 150 RBIs half asleep now is a real candidate even if his team isn't that great.



They are two sides of the same coin, just at different lineup spots. Kinsler is a leadoff hitter with a .397 obp, a lot of extra base hits and 23 steals. This has a huge impact on how many rbis hamilton has. On the flipside, kinsler in his own right is on pace for a ridiculous 144 runs, with the same credit due to hamilton/bradley. They are both good in each category on their own, but have helped eachother into the next level.

And kinsler is on pace for 99 rbis, not exactly poor for a leadoff hitter.
He also leads hamilton in .ops, .945 to .919.

Kinsler leads the american league in batting average, hits, runs, total bases and extra base hits. He is top 7 in slugging, on base percentage and steals.

Hamilton has been awesome, but RBIs are his only one truly standout MVP type number and its the stat most dependant on your lineup.

A case can certainly be made for hamilton and I think he will be better post ASB than he was before it (aside from rbis), but you cant dismiss kinsler because a leadoff hitter cant stack up to a middle of the order hitter in rbis.


completely agreed. to call hamilton an mvp because he has more rbi is ridiculous. but to be honest, neither would win this contest if the year ended now. the rangers simply arent good enough.
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby pangbones » Sun Jul 13, 2008 11:44 pm

I think Both Hamilton and Kinsler belong in the conversation, but I think Kinsler has been the MVP of the AL to date.
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby thedude » Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:03 am

Well RBIs and runs are lousy ways to judge the value of a hitter because they are dependent on the team. It makes sense that a guy with a ton of rbis would be hitting behind a guy with a ton of runs and vica-versa. Considering that there is no agreement as whether Kinsler and Hamilton or is most valuable to the Rangers and the Rangers are in third place (7.5 games out) and are not leading the wild card i would argue that neither is AL MVP at this point. Besides there are players with better numbers.

If you use OPS, then Milton Bradly is the MVP of the Rangers and JD Drew is probably the MVP of the league (2nd in OPS and considering what he has done with Ortiz injured...).
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Re: Both League's MVPs Could be Second Basemen

Postby DSheppard » Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:20 am

The rangers have the worst starting rotation and one of the (if not the) worst bullpens in the league. I think them being 4 games over 500 endorses how good the 3 mvp candidates have been.

and in the NL east the rangers would be 2 games back of the philly. The angels happen to be 5.5 ahead of the phillies in a theoretical division.
Last edited by DSheppard on Mon Jul 14, 2008 2:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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