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Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

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Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby Willy T 4 MVP » Fri Jun 13, 2008 9:03 pm

Here's a quick bit of background:

I created a new big money keeper league this year. I was sick of being in 4-5 smaller, weak leagues so i created a league where I'd only invite proven strong GMs. In any league (but in a strong league in particular), i feel that trades should only be vetoed in cases of collusion, one GM tanking, or some sort of other egregious misconduct.

The veto rules are as follows: commish (me) has authority over vetoes, unless he is involed. if i'm involved, a preselcted panel of 3 other league members votes on the trade.

So far this season, the league has been running very smoothly. No trades have been vetoed and I've made the most trades out of anyone (by far). Everyone seems to think that i've won all my trades. My trades were:

Weeks for Snell (early in the season when snell was on fire)
Victorino for Garko/Bell (when victorino was hurt)
Ocab for Greg Smith (when ocab was hitting a buck fifty)
Billingsley for Oliver Perez and Daniel Cabrera (before ollie imploded and before bills turned it around)
Rollins/Street for Cantu/Danks/Votto/Jeter (the day rollins came off the DL)

I would be the first to admit that i've won all 5 trades. Note that these 5 trades happened with 4 different GMs (out of 10 total), so it's not as if im repeatedly taking advantage of a weak GM. Each trade was approved by the afformetioned council of 3 voters. The one trade that caused controversy was the rollins trade. a lot of people felt that i was completely ripping the guy off and a few GMs were extremely upset (it's understandable - there's a lot of money at stake and some guy appears to be stacking his team). For what it's worth - my view (and rememeber, i dont have a vote anyway) was that i was getting a great deal, but that a reasonable argument could be made for the cantu side of things and since there was obviously no collusion there should be no veto. the trade went though but a few ppl (outside the council of three) were pretty pissed.

Fast forward to this morning. I'm in 2nd place and made a trade with the 4th place team.

I gave Hart ($15) and Carlos Guillen ($11)
I got MCab ($36) and Furcal ($9)

(Note that based on our keeper rules ($5 penalty per keeper), none of the players in question is considered to be an attractive keeper candidate).

Keep in mind that both MCab and furcal were posted on the official "on the block" page about 3 weeks ago. so everyone in the league knew they were being shopped and everyone in the legaue had a fair crack at acquiring mcab and furcal. The council of three told me today that "based on your track record we cant let this trade through - bc ppl will get so mad that it will kill the league". they specifically referenced the rollins trade (which i admit was a ripoff, but not a vetoable one) as one that really pissed people off.

My response to this is that the track record of the guy doing the ripping off is irrelevant. If i was the guy who was contantly GETTING ripped off, then it would be logical to call my judgement into question and to closely monitor all my future trades. however, im the one supposedly WINNING the trades and each one is with a DIFFERENT team. so what if i keep fleecing people? im supposed to try to fleece people! there are only 10 teams in the league - is the entire league colluding to make me win? the guy who traded Mcab to me hasn't made a trade all season, so his judgement/ethics are not being called into question. the council of three told me straight out that "had anyone else made the trade, we wouldnt veto. but since you made the trade, people are gonna be so pissed off that it's gonna ruin the league". the illogic of such a statement is totally mindboggling to me. they also told me straight out that had i been the one giving up mcab, theyd have no problem with the trade. this is absolutely infuriating to me - am i crazy?

if you ask me:

1) the trade isnt lopsided at all. mcab is the biggest 1st round bust of the season thus far and furcal could EASILY be injured or innefective all season. hart is on fire and was recently put in the leadoff spot which can only increase his value

2) vetoing a trade for fear that a few irrational owners will get upset and ruin the league is ludicrous. this veto system is in place for a reason. it's in place b/c when emotions are running high (as they always do in a fantasy league), many ppl are incapable of voting rationally. if i had my way, id never want my archrival to improve his team. but im a big boy so i just suck it up and try to outsmart him the next day.

I've been arguing with these guys all day long, but they dont seem like they're gonna budge. I'm at the mercy of the experts here at the Cafe. please tell me if I'm crazy or if these guys are totally hosing me. not to sound paranoid, but they're basically conspiring to make sure i cant improve my team - insane!!

oh and btw here's a classic line from one of the 3 guys who has a vote: "its one thing if you were giving him markakis instead of hart. but hart? hart sucks!"
it's just this type of insanity that has me punching walls today. by any reasonable objective measure, corey hart and nick markakis are at least very close in value. i actually think hart is better for this season (i drafted hart for 15 and markakis for 16). i feel like im taking crazy pills.

Someone PLEASE shed some rational/logical light on this situation for me. Thanks in advance and sorry for the long rant/bitchfest.
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby Willy T 4 MVP » Sat Jun 14, 2008 12:30 am

bump
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby bpizle » Sat Jun 14, 2008 2:18 am

I read about 2 sentences and got the gist of what your trying to say. I didnt need to read the rant.. Anyway, alot of owners reject trades/object not only because they are a better team, but simply because alot of owners like the adrenaline or excitment of actually doing a trade in general, when they arent in a trade it leaves them with nothing to do. With the reject/veto policy it gives them virtual control of your trades/ and maybe even your team.. thats why in my league, all trades are approved by ME..
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby Willy T 4 MVP » Sat Jun 14, 2008 2:39 am

bpizle wrote:I read about 2 sentences and got the gist of what your trying to say. I didnt need to read the rant.. Anyway, alot of owners reject trades/object not only because they are a better team, but simply because alot of owners like the adrenaline or excitment of actually doing a trade in general, when they arent in a trade it leaves them with nothing to do. With the reject/veto policy it gives them virtual control of your trades/ and maybe even your team.. thats why in my league, all trades are approved by ME..


couldn't agree more with this. this is why all trades are approved by ME in my league as well. however, in the interest of fairness since there's a lot of $ at stake, i agreed to let 3 ppl vote if i was involved in a trade. this is coming back to bite me in the ass.
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby Matthias » Sat Jun 14, 2008 10:29 am

Willy T 4 MVP wrote:Someone PLEASE shed some rational/logical light on this situation for me. Thanks in advance and sorry for the long rant/bitchfest.

Willy T 4 MVP wrote:I created a new big money keeper league this year. I was sick of being in 4-5 smaller, weak leagues so i created a league where I'd only invite proven strong GMs. In any league (but in a strong league in particular), i feel that trades should only be vetoed in cases of collusion, one GM tanking, or some sort of other egregious misconduct.

The veto rules are as follows: commish (me) has authority over vetoes, unless he is involed. if i'm involved, a preselcted panel of 3 other league members votes on the trade.

Here's a rational light. You created the league; you created the rules; you created the panel to review your trades.

Stop climbing the walls and start accepting their decisions.
0-3 to 4-3. Worst choke in the history of baseball. Enough said.
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby Willy T 4 MVP » Sat Jun 14, 2008 1:32 pm

Matthias wrote:Here's a rational light. You created the league; you created the rules; you created the panel to review your trades.

Stop climbing the walls and start accepting their decisions.


you're absolutely right. i have to accept their ruling regardless of how stupid it is. that doesn't mean i have to like it. i posted b/c i wanted to know if you guys thought i was wrong to think that i'm getting hosed.
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby Bobbleheadrusty » Sun Jun 15, 2008 10:46 pm

Willy T 4 MVP wrote:
Matthias wrote:Here's a rational light. You created the league; you created the rules; you created the panel to review your trades.

Stop climbing the walls and start accepting their decisions.


you're absolutely right. i have to accept their ruling regardless of how stupid it is. that doesn't mean i have to like it. i posted b/c i wanted to know if you guys thought i was wrong to think that i'm getting hosed.



No, you posted so you could complain. Nothing wrong with that, but its not like you needed advice.

Brief aside, I actually buy into the "too many lopsided trades can kill a deal" argument.
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby bpizle » Mon Jun 16, 2008 9:56 pm

Yea, this isnt a question, its just a fact that all fantasy leagues are like this (at least most) and you really cant do a damn thing about it. Unless you change the rules. :~(
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby CBMGreatOne » Tue Jun 17, 2008 4:40 pm

Well, I do think that this last deal, and the Rollins deal, are borderline (though not conclusively) vetoable. While I don't particularly like the reasoning of your panel of three, you chose them, you delegated them the authority to approve or veto your trades, and Matthias is right on. You don't have any clout here. You made your bed, now lie in it.

I'd be a little peeved with their reasoning as well though, for what it's worth.
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Re: Fellow Commissioners - PLEASE HELP!!!!

Postby urbanbreez » Tue Jun 17, 2008 4:57 pm

I don't like this whole "trades are approved by me" crap. Especially when money is involved. Vetos should be handled in a restricted democracy. Like: 4 manager votes are required to veto a deal. Thats it.
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