Verlander or Harden? - Fantasy Baseball Cafe 2014 Fantasy Baseball Cafe
100% Deposit Bonus for Cafe Members!

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Verlander or Harden?

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby ScrappyDoo » Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:08 pm

I was just waiting for the end of the month or so to update. Verlander had a great stretch of 5 or so games but he has started to blow up a little bit recently.

Month of July

Harden - 34.1 IP, 1 W, 1.83 ERA, 48 K, 13 BB, 24 H
Verlander - 38.1 IP, 4 W, 4.70 ERA, 35 K, 13 BB, 31 H

At this point the debate is over. Harden could lose both his arms and still would be more valuable than Verlander. Harden has been able to stay healthy and post dominant numbers.

These are the ER per game allowed by Harden on the year.

1, 0, 5, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 0, 1, 0, 2, 2, 0, 1, 1, 1

The game he pitched @ TEX stands out where he gave up 5 runs, but other than that, Harden is pretty consistently dominant. His K/9 in the NL is over 14.

Harden is a huge injury risk and cost a lot of people in the past. This year is the complete opposite. He has been the best pitcher this year in all the majors. The only thing standing in his way is bad luck and a bad bullpen blowing his lead. Considering he was drafted around 150, he is easily one of the biggest steals this year.
ScrappyDoo
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 962
Joined: 5 May 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby garretatkinspride » Mon Aug 04, 2008 3:06 pm

find someone to trade for harden. i would go with verlander as he is less injury prone and should turn it around soon.
garretatkinspride Beginner
Little League Legend
Little League Legend


Posts: 13
Joined: 2 Jul 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby daniel80111 » Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:02 pm

How bad is Verlander?? wow, I knew the overrated FIP stats meant something. Most overrated pitcher coming into fantasy this year by far.
daniel80111
College Coach
College Coach


Posts: 210
Joined: 7 Sep 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby Yoda » Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:04 pm

Isn't there a saying about a squirrel? A blind one? And a nut? Does that apply to this thread? :-D
"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." ~George Carlin
Yoda
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Fantasy ExpertMock(ing) Drafter
Posts: 21344
Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: 15th green...

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby jake_twothousandfive » Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:09 pm

daniel80111 wrote:How bad is Verlander?? wow, I knew the overrated FIP stats meant something. Most overrated pitcher coming into fantasy this year by far.

Don't know how you can say he was way more overrated than anyone else. There are a couple of guys you could make a case for. As a Twins fan it pains me to say it, but at least coming into the year Liriano was vastly overrated. Everyone (including me) should have been expecting early troubles.

Verlander had two great years in a row coming into this year, and has all the tools needed to be an ace so I don't think he was overrated. He's been a semi-bust, but the praise around him has largely been legit.
Image
"Don't take anything for granted, because tomorrow is not promised to any of us." ---Kirby Puckett
jake_twothousandfive
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterWeb Supporter
Posts: 4264
Joined: 22 Oct 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby Inukchuk » Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:39 am

I would say that if their numbers stay relatively close to where they are now for the remainder of the season, then Harden's value will be at its apex and Verlander's will be rock bottom going into '09 drafts.

I wouldn't hop on Verlander as my ace next year (of course, I wouldn't have done it this year, either), but he could be the guy that gives you ace numbers for #2 (or maybe even #3... :-o ) pitcher value.
Image
abrunn11... the place to go for all your sig needs...
Inukchuk
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterMock(ing) Drafter
Posts: 4014
Joined: 24 Jan 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Coming down on this hospital like the hammer of Thor

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby Dan Lambskin » Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:10 pm

Inukchuk wrote:I would say that if their numbers stay relatively close to where they are now for the remainder of the season, then Harden's value will be at its apex and Verlander's will be rock bottom going into '09 drafts.

I wouldn't hop on Verlander as my ace next year (of course, I wouldn't have done it this year, either), but he could be the guy that gives you ace numbers for #2 (or maybe even #3... :-o ) pitcher value.


i totally bit on Verlander being a Cy Young contender this year, but with that said i wonder how many people would draft Harden before him next year...i still wouldnt
Image
Dan Lambskin
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicCafe RankerMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeLucky Ladders ChampionPick 3 Weekly WinnerMatchup Meltdown SurvivorTrivia Time Trial Monthly Winner
Posts: 10225
Joined: 20 Mar 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby Inukchuk » Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:10 pm

I wouldn't either, but from the love Harden's been getting this year, I can see it happening in a good chunk of drafts next year, particularly if he makes it through the next 7 weeks injury free.
Image
abrunn11... the place to go for all your sig needs...
Inukchuk
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterMock(ing) Drafter
Posts: 4014
Joined: 24 Jan 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Coming down on this hospital like the hammer of Thor

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby Yoda » Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:16 pm

I still don't believe that he will stay injury free for the rest of this season but I do hope that he does. It's nice to see one of the most talented pitchers in baseball finally putting it together. Just a few years ago, I expected Prior and Harden to have won several Cy Young awards each by now.

As for next year, I still won't buy him. If he went in the 12th-13th round this year then I can't imagine him lasting 5 rounds.
"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." ~George Carlin
Yoda
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Fantasy ExpertMock(ing) Drafter
Posts: 21344
Joined: 21 Jan 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: 15th green...

Re: Verlander or Harden?

Postby RedHopeful » Fri Aug 15, 2008 1:03 am

Leyland talking about Verlander having a dead arm and now Yahoo is reporting a scout thinks he's regressed? :-o

ESPN.com's Jayson Stark reports a scout said Detroit Tigers SP Justin Verlander has regressed. "His stuff is now a grade below what it was. He's become a two-seam sinkerball pitcher. Where's the front-door hammer (curveball)? Where's that four-seam fastball he used to bang guys away with? I'm not seeing it. I'm seeing a lot of contact, and the hitters look way too comfortable," the scout said.
RedHopeful
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
CafeholicBasketball ModPick 3 Weekly WinnerLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 3275
(Past Year: 84)
Joined: 11 Jul 2007
Home Cafe: Basketball
Location: Hank Aaron's backyard

PreviousNext

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: exm and 8 guests

Forums Articles & Tips Sleepers Rankings Leagues


Today's Games
Wednesday, Oct. 22
(All times are EST, weather icons show forecast for game time)

San Francisco at Kansas City
(8:07 pm)

  • Fantasy Baseball
  • Article Submissions
  • Privacy Statement
  • Site Survey 
  • Contact