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June 1: When Trading Begins

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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby Slayer Rules » Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:28 pm

Matthias wrote:I think he means guys who won't make trades unless the deal is blatantly and lopsidedly in their favor. I have guys like this in my league as well, guys who won't make deals that benefit both teams but instead want to try to fleece the other guy.



I can share a case in point. Just last week I decided I'd try to trade Felix for Carlos Gomez for my pitching-heavy/speed-poor team. I knew I'd be selling low, but I was pretty sure I'd get a deal done. The Gomez owner is ranked @ #7 or lower in all 5 pitching cats, while I'm ranked @ #11 or better in all of them and only ranked @ #3 for steals. It seemed like a reasonable offer that would help both teams. I'm sure that many here would say that I would be getting hosed in the deal. Here was the message that accompanied the trade rejection:


"If you want Gomez, who is the 40th ranked player on Yahoo, you will have to do a lot better than Felix (not having a good season and on a bad club). I really don't need pitching, but I do need a power hitter. I would consider Votto + 1 or Ryan Howard. Gomez is constituting (sic) in all 5 cats.

Think about it."


Good times....
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby j24jags » Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:39 pm

One of my $ leagues has had 4 trades go through so far and I have been involved in two. My cafe league is the same story (I've been involved in 2 out of 4). In the Cafe league my team has been around 12th out of 16 so I made 2 trades in the last 10 days to make a few much needed changes, I got Pujols and Beltran (Who caught fire when I got him). Lastly, my other $ league has also had 4 trades and I have been involved in 3. I consider myself a very active trader and by no means the "douche."
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby WyldStallyn » Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:45 pm

Slayer Rules wrote:Think about it."


haha, love the ending. yea, gomez will really carry a team in all cats
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby CBMGreatOne » Mon Jun 02, 2008 2:58 pm

Matthias wrote:
Yanks_Baby wrote:Same here. I see no point in a "fair" trade, because if iit's fair for both sides, I'm helping my competition as much as myself, making the trade pointless.

This is a wrong attitude for a number of reasons.
1) It's a competition of 10, 12, 14, or however many guys, not just two. So the mentality of, "he has to lose if I am going to win" doesn't apply.
2) Different teams have different needs. So you might be miles ahead of the pack in K's, W's, and ERA but only middle-of-the-road on HRs, Rs, and RBIs. Trading a pitcher for a hitter, even if precisely equal value, still is to your benefit in the overall scheme of things.
3) The competition is enjoyable in fantasy baseball, but another primary aspect is interacting with your friends and family. If you're always going to be "that guy" it just hurts your reputation overall, even outside of your league.
4) You eventually just lose your trading partners as people just figure out there's no point in broaching anything since you'll just demand Albert Pujols for your Ryan Ludwick.
5) It's a douchey way to do things. And it always sucks to be the douche.


In my leagues, most people have made deals frequently enough, but there are two or three who have developed the reputation for never trading unless they can rape their trade partner. I, for one, pretty much stop sending offers to such an owner, since I know that the best I can hope for is a counter-offer buying low on one of my top 3 players.
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby Yanks_Baby » Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:00 pm

CBMGreatOne wrote:
Matthias wrote:
Yanks_Baby wrote:Same here. I see no point in a "fair" trade, because if iit's fair for both sides, I'm helping my competition as much as myself, making the trade pointless.

This is a wrong attitude for a number of reasons.
1) It's a competition of 10, 12, 14, or however many guys, not just two. So the mentality of, "he has to lose if I am going to win" doesn't apply.
2) Different teams have different needs. So you might be miles ahead of the pack in K's, W's, and ERA but only middle-of-the-road on HRs, Rs, and RBIs. Trading a pitcher for a hitter, even if precisely equal value, still is to your benefit in the overall scheme of things.
3) The competition is enjoyable in fantasy baseball, but another primary aspect is interacting with your friends and family. If you're always going to be "that guy" it just hurts your reputation overall, even outside of your league.
4) You eventually just lose your trading partners as people just figure out there's no point in broaching anything since you'll just demand Albert Pujols for your Ryan Ludwick.
5) It's a douchey way to do things. And it always sucks to be the douche.


In my leagues, most people have made deals frequently enough, but there are two or three who have developed the reputation for never trading unless they can rape their trade partner. I, for one, pretty much stop sending offers to such an owner, since I know that the best I can hope for is a counter-offer buying low on one of my top 3 players.
See, I don't do that. I don't demand more than Felix Hernandez for Carlos Gomez. However, I would try to get Felix Hernandez for Carlos Gomez, which to me is very lopsided, but to others may seem about fair.

It's all about perception. I always get the better deal in my opinion, just not in the rest of the league's eyes.
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby Matthias » Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:02 pm

CBMGreatOne wrote:In my leagues, most people have made deals frequently enough, but there are two or three who have developed the reputation for never trading unless they can rape their trade partner. I, for one, pretty much stop sending offers to such an owner, since I know that the best I can hope for is a counter-offer buying low on one of my top 3 players.

Exactly.
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby markj11 » Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:14 pm

I have yet to make a trade and usually only make a few trades per year. I make fair trades and most of the time give a little more than I should to get what I need. I am currently looking for a reliable catcher am willing to over pay. I made one trade last year and greatly over paid. I cant remember all the details but it is a keeper league and I gave B. Phillips and someone for Smoltz and Rivera because that is what I needed to win. I rejected this offer this morning: his ARam/Jenks for my Braun/Sherrill. Now what is the point of that? Am I supposed to counter? Why, I want a catcher and he doesn't have one.
I ain't askin' nobody for nothin, If I can't get it on my own. - Charlie Daniels
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby Yoda » Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:22 pm

I think timing is essential when it comes down to trading. A month ago, most people wouldn't think this was a bad trade and some people probably still don't think this is bad:
BJ Upton/Sheets
for
Braun/Billingsley

Since then Braun has caught absolute fire and Billingsley is pitching very well so the trade worked out for me so far. At the time some of my league mates were bitching about it but it is still an equitable trade.
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby Yanks_Baby » Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:29 pm

Yoda wrote:I think timing is essential when it comes down to trading. A month ago, most people wouldn't think this was a bad trade and some people probably still don't think this is bad:
BJ Upton/Sheets
for
Braun/Billingsley

Since then Braun has caught absolute fire and Billingsley is pitching very well so the trade worked out for me so far. At the time some of my league mates were bitching about it but it is still an equitable trade.

I made a similar trade.

Ben Sheets/Bourn
for
Teixeira

Early in the season. Borun was hitting like 250 and leading the MLB in steals at the time, and Sheets had given up like 1 earned run in 3 starts or something, while Tex was batting like 230 with 1 homer. Seemed horrible, ended up great.

Yoda knows what I'm talking about though. Gtetting the upper hand of a lopsided deal, without it being rape.
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Re: June 1: When Trading Begins

Postby Matthias » Mon Jun 02, 2008 4:04 pm

Yanks_Baby wrote:Yoda knows what I'm talking about though. Gtetting the upper hand of a lopsided deal, without it being rape.

Yah, except that's not what everyone else is talking about.

What everyone else is talking about is when you offer a guy Justin Upton for his Dana Eveland and he counters by demanding Soriano.
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