urbanbreez wrote:"The Yanks O is only 2nd the Tigers in my eye..."
This use of sexual innuendo is disturbing....
honestly leaving out 'to' is more disturbing to me
but yeah, i see no reason why shields doesnt reach 200 ks this year. With a sub 1.20 whip and 10+ wins, I dont see whats not to like. His stats last year being in the AL East only give me more reason to love him. Sit him against DET NYY BOS if you really have mixed feelings but he's a viable soft ace, hes my number 4 in my most important league, and thats only because of the pure talent I have infront of him in Kazmir, Hamels, and Young (who I can see him possibly outperforming) as well as Ervin Santana (I plan on only starting him at home...benched him tonight @DET and hes gone 3 perfect with 3K, I might just have to start him everywhere! (now that i said that hell get bombed)), Greinke (who I dropped Maine for - Im still partial on that move but Ill take the ratio help over Maine Ks cause of Hamels and Kaz), and Marcum (one of the last 2 will be dropped when Kaz comes off the DL).
Surfs up wrote:I just think that Cano has come back to earth. He's a little overated in my mind. Damons best years are behind him. Giambi is hitting something like a buck twenty.Posanda had his career year. Age will catch up to him very soon. Don't get me wrong Yes the Yankees have a good team. But Loaded? Nope . Sorry I'm not convinced. I don't go by last years numbers.The Red Sox lead the league in scoring and in batting average. The Tigers will come around. Anyway back to Shields. I like him and the the Rays.They'll score a bunch of runs. They are grwoing and gaining more confidence each game. No more doormat.
I agree Giambi and Damon are washed up, but they still put fear into almost any pitcher just by being part of that lineup.
There really are no easy outs.
Also bear in mind most of that lineup has done nothing so far.
And I agree with TB. Bearing in mind that I have no idea what the Yankees are going to look like in 2 years, and that the Red Sox could possibly lose Manny, I see TB in the playoffs in 2010, this team they have right now is set up for success; and very, very young. Besides the bullpen the only issue I have with them as a team is age.
And it's a good issue.
Here's a few notables (starters) they have under the age of 30...
Their current roster has more players 24 and under than 30 and over. (ok so thats a lie, they have 8 30+, but only 2 of them (Hinske, Floyd) are NOT relief pitchers...). Hinske is the ONLY position player currently over 30, and hes no more than that, only 30. Just some food for thought.
And lets not forget about Price or any of the other prospects who arnt MLBers yet.
BUT I DIGRESS....back to Shields...an interesting note pointed out by BP about Sheilds on his '01:
"Shields has good command of his fastball, which was clocked as high as 91 mph last summer. He also has a plus curveball that features sharp, late-breaking action, making it particularly troublesome for right-handers. Shields has impressive determination and excellent endurance…His changeup is no better than average, but the Rays believe that once he makes it more consistent, he could move rapidly. Shields made the most of his opportunities last year."
about his '05
"He did not surrender more than four earned runs in any of his 16 starts and held opponents to two runs or less in 10 of those outings. Though not overpowering for a right-hander, Shields showed he has the overall package to be a solid fourth starter in the big leagues. He has a good run on his 89-92 mph fastball, and he controls and commands it well. His changeup is his best offering, possessing excellent deception and fade. Shields works with two breaking balls, a curveball and a slurvy slider. He uses the curve to change planes on hitters, and his slider as a chase pitch down and away to right-handers. He needs to sharpen one of the breaking balls in order to have a solid third pitch. Shields also has a little length to his arm action and could add some strength to his tall and slender frame. He worked on those elements during a strong effort in the Arizona Fall League, where he ranked second with a 1.74 ERA…"
So he went from having a PLUS curv to having no solid 3rd pitch 4 years later.
My favorite little nitpick on him is this little bit from his 06 stint in Durham before getting the call:
Surfs up wrote:I just think that Cano has come back to earth. He's a little overated in my mind. Damons best years are behind him. Giambi is hitting something like a buck twenty.Posanda had his career year. Age will catch up to him very soon. Don't get me wrong Yes the Yankees have a good team. But Loaded? Nope . Sorry I'm not convinced. I don't go by last years numbers.The Red Sox lead the league in scoring and in batting average. The Tigers will come around. Anyway back to Shields. I like him and the the Rays.They'll score a bunch of runs. They are grwoing and gaining more confidence each game. No more doormat.
I agree Giambi and Damon are washed up, but they still put fear into almost any pitcher just by being part of that lineup.
There really are no easy outs.
Also bear in mind most of that lineup has done nothing so far.
And I agree with TB. Bearing in mind that I have no idea what the Yankees are going to look like in 2 years, and that the Red Sox could possibly lose Manny, I see TB in the playoffs in 2010, this team they have right now is set up for success; and very, very young. Besides the bullpen the only issue I have with them as a team is age.
And it's a good issue.
Here's a few notables (starters) they have under the age of 30...
Their current roster has more players 24 and under than 30 and over. (ok so thats a lie, they have 8 30+, but only 2 of them (Hinske, Floyd) are NOT relief pitchers...). Hinske is the ONLY position player currently over 30, and hes no more than that, only 30. Just some food for thought.
And lets not forget about Price or any of the other prospects who arnt MLBers yet.
BUT I DIGRESS....back to Shields...an interesting note pointed out by BP about Sheilds on his '01:
"Shields has good command of his fastball, which was clocked as high as 91 mph last summer. He also has a plus curveball that features sharp, late-breaking action, making it particularly troublesome for right-handers. Shields has impressive determination and excellent endurance…His changeup is no better than average, but the Rays believe that once he makes it more consistent, he could move rapidly. Shields made the most of his opportunities last year."
about his '05
"He did not surrender more than four earned runs in any of his 16 starts and held opponents to two runs or less in 10 of those outings. Though not overpowering for a right-hander, Shields showed he has the overall package to be a solid fourth starter in the big leagues. He has a good run on his 89-92 mph fastball, and he controls and commands it well. His changeup is his best offering, possessing excellent deception and fade. Shields works with two breaking balls, a curveball and a slurvy slider. He uses the curve to change planes on hitters, and his slider as a chase pitch down and away to right-handers. He needs to sharpen one of the breaking balls in order to have a solid third pitch. Shields also has a little length to his arm action and could add some strength to his tall and slender frame. He worked on those elements during a strong effort in the Arizona Fall League, where he ranked second with a 1.74 ERA…"
So he went from having a PLUS curv to having no solid 3rd pitch 4 years later.
My favorite little nitpick on him is this little bit from his 06 stint in Durham before getting the call:
deerayfan072 wrote: You do know the Rays bullpen has one of the best ERA's in baseball this season right?
so far.
haha no i didnt know that actually.
i knew percy was doing just dandy but other than that im clueless on their pen.
Howell just gave up a run, but coming into the game the Rays had the best Bullpen ERA in the majors. They aren't that good, but they are a big improvement from last year
I love Shields as much as the next guy. I picked him up in my dynasty in '06 after seeing 60 innings 6 walks 60 Ks at AAA. However I recently traded him for Rickie Weeks and don't regret it one bit. I think he is one of those guys who has a "name" that you can trade for more then he's worth. I'd trade him while people still think he can develop into a 9 K/9 pitcher (which he probably won't).
AussieDodger
Hall of Fame Hero
Posts: 11294
(Past Year: 420)
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Bases this season: 470
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: What do you mean, Flash Gordon approaching?
deerayfan072 wrote: You do know the Rays bullpen has one of the best ERA's in baseball this season right?
so far.
haha no i didnt know that actually.
i knew percy was doing just dandy but other than that im clueless on their pen.
Howell just gave up a run, but coming into the game the Rays had the best Bullpen ERA in the majors. They aren't that good, but they are a big improvement from last year
And if they can be more consistent, the Rays will have something to say about who wins the AL East this year. Seemed like last year, their starters would do well against the Sox and then as soon as they went to the bullpen...BAM, the game got blown wide open. Its early and they won't be this good all year, but definitely should be much more improved over last year.
One of my concerns about Shields is not the pitcher himself but that defense. His last three games had a slew of unearned runs caused by some error or another. If it's an ongoing thing, Shields might lose a few wins that he otherwise could've gotten.
MashinSpuds wrote:One of my concerns about Shields is not the pitcher himself but that defense. His last three games had a slew of unearned runs caused by some error or another. If it's an ongoing thing, Shields might lose a few wins that he otherwise could've gotten.
The defense behind him is actually really good. Anyone that watched the Rays game last night and saw the 2 catches by BJ and CC, and also the 3 DPs turned by the INF to keep the game tied can attest to that. For some reason they just have not played well with Jamie on the mound. I do have to say that one of the errors was Riggans (who won't be playing much with Navi back), Hinske at 1B (He won't be playing there much), Bartlett (He has looked much better since the game he made that throwing error, and the other was BJ trying to do too much, which he will learn. The defense will be fine and his WHIP and ERA should start to see that soon
MashinSpuds wrote:One of my concerns about Shields is not the pitcher himself but that defense. His last three games had a slew of unearned runs caused by some error or another. If it's an ongoing thing, Shields might lose a few wins that he otherwise could've gotten.
If the 08 version of the Rays defense worries you, its a good thing you didn't see the 07 version. This years team is much improved defensively, but they are still not a good defensive team yet. They need some more experience, which is why I think we could see a huge Shields break out next year as the defense improves, notably Upton in center, Longoria at 3rd, and Iwamura getting more accustomed to 2nd.
Users browsing this forum: Ajqpvzdw, apz, bibihuklier, cersabieroist, Deborahnfh, DureSNurb, Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], SpecialFNK, trebor67 and 26 guests
Cafe Home
Fantasy Football
Fantasy Basketball
Fantasy Hockey
by DeadWinterDay » Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:58 pm 
/charlie2.gif){kind=small}
