Texas Polygamy Situation - Fantasy Baseball Cafe 2014 Fantasy Baseball Cafe
100% Deposit Bonus for Cafe Members!

Return to General Talk

Texas Polygamy Situation

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby JTWood » Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:39 am

I like the philosophical argument in this thread, but mental maturity is not even an issue here.

These people may be practicing freedom of religion in some way or another, but if they're breaking the laws of this country that apply to everyone regardless of religion, then they are criminals. It's really that simple. You can argue semantics all you want, but sex with a minor is illegal with only the age making the difference between states. If they are indeed sleeping with preteens, it's statutory rape. Nothing else matters, and no freedom of religion argument will make a difference to any court in this country.
Image
JTWood
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterEagle EyeWeb Supporter
Posts: 11508
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Unincorporated Heaven

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby knapplc » Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:49 am

Tavish wrote:
knapplc wrote:That's swell in an abstract sort of way, but in this real world situation, these 12-year-olds were raped. If you want to split hairs and say that only some of these 12-year-olds were raped that's your gig, not mine. To me - and maybe I'm kind of crazy or something - but to me, even one 12-year-old getting raped is too many. Are you saying that's not how you see it? :-o

You got me. Obviously I think all 12 year olds should be forcibly raped. Sort of right of passage. I also support clubbing infants, enforcing euthanasia, and the Republican party in power. Now that we have that all cleared up, here is one for you. Is our culture's moral compass so infallible that the large number of other culture that have the age of consent between the age 12 and 14 corrupted and they are promoting rape? You don't even have to go back very far in US history to get to a point in time where it wasn't all that uncommon for a 40 year old man to marry and start a family with a 13 or 14 year old girl.

I certainly don't think my 13 year old daughter is mature enough to consent to marriage, whether that is true or not I don't know. It just may be my protectiveness and moral upbringing that makes me feel that way. But I do think that she is mature enough to consent to sex, we have done everything we can to educate her of what that choice means (from pregnancy and disease to the value of the gift of virginity). That doesn't mean that if I found out she was having sex that I wouldn't be at the guys door in a minute with a baseball bat and a pair of tin snips to help educate him on what his choice means as well. :-{

JB and JT really answered this better than I could. I know you're not advocating rape, but when we're talking about forced marriages including "intercourse" (rape), and I'm getting rebuttals of "age of consent," it comes across as an apology for child rape. Age of Consent is simply not a rebuttal in an argument of rape.
Keep wreves in General Talk in 2011!
knapplc
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicGolden Eagle Eye
Posts: 7870
Joined: 27 Dec 2004
Home Cafe: Football
Location: It's "ell see." ELL SEE!!!

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby RugbyD » Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:23 am

JTWood wrote:You can argue semantics all you want, but sex with a minor is illegal with only the age making the difference between states.

This just goes to prove my point that age of consent is a subjective concept, even in the sense of societal average. And in this case it looks like we're dealing with a closed society far from the average.
TennCare rocks!!!!
RugbyD
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Cafe Ranker
Posts: 5591
Joined: 7 Dec 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: punting small dogs and being surly

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby StlSluggers » Thu Apr 17, 2008 10:03 am

RugbyD wrote:
JTWood wrote:You can argue semantics all you want, but sex with a minor is illegal with only the age making the difference between states.

This just goes to prove my point that age of consent is a subjective concept, even in the sense of societal average. And in this case it looks like we're dealing with a closed society far from the average.

Absolutely, and I completely agree with the philosophical point you're making. I guarantee you that if the average life expectancy of a human dropped back to 30 years, that we'd see women giving birth at 11 or 12 years of age en masse. Would that be wrong? Most certainly not. The women would be raised with the expectation that they'd become mothers at a very early age, and that would be the norm.
StlSluggers
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterMock(ing) DrafterWeb Supporter
Posts: 14716
(Past Year: 10)
Joined: 24 May 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Parking in the gov't bldg @ 7th and Pine. It's only $3.00 on game day!

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby Mookie4ever » Thu Apr 17, 2008 10:03 am

I've gotten complaints about some posts in this thread. I've read everything and there is nothing that I am going to take out, edit or card. But I will say that if you can't handle the discussion get out of it and if you post anything deliberately insulting or to instigate you will be carded.
Image
Mookie4ever
Head Moderator
Head Moderator

User avatar
ModeratorCafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe WriterMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeCafe SpotterHockey ModBasketball ModFootball ModMatchup Meltdown ChampionPick 3 Weekly WinnerSweet 16 SurvivorLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 19542
(Past Year: 281)
Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Hakuna, Montana

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby Mookie4ever » Thu Apr 17, 2008 10:09 am

StlSluggers wrote:
RugbyD wrote:
JTWood wrote:You can argue semantics all you want, but sex with a minor is illegal with only the age making the difference between states.

This just goes to prove my point that age of consent is a subjective concept, even in the sense of societal average. And in this case it looks like we're dealing with a closed society far from the average.

Absolutely, and I completely agree with the philosophical point you're making. I guarantee you that if the average life expectancy of a human dropped back to 30 years, that we'd see women giving birth at 11 or 12 years of age en masse. Would that be wrong? Most certainly not. The women would be raised with the expectation that they'd become mothers at a very early age, and that would be the norm.



Sure. And in a society with the health care and wealth such that parents do not need to be supported byt their children and can continue to be productive into their 50s 60s and even 70s and can afford to have their little girls watch Dora and go to school and live with their parents until they are 18 or 19 then the little girls can take their time maturing and are certainly not mature enough for sex until a much later age. Sex with these girls at the age of 12 or 13 fits the definition of rape regardless of what psysiology says.
Image
Mookie4ever
Head Moderator
Head Moderator

User avatar
ModeratorCafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe WriterMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeCafe SpotterHockey ModBasketball ModFootball ModMatchup Meltdown ChampionPick 3 Weekly WinnerSweet 16 SurvivorLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 19542
(Past Year: 281)
Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Hakuna, Montana

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby Simulacrum » Thu Apr 17, 2008 12:38 pm

Personally, I think anyone that would prefer to have sex with a 12 year old girl instead of an 18-30 year old woman is out of their ever-loving mind and should be removed from the human race, genitals first.
Image
2008 Cafeholics Pond Scum Champion
Future Champion of 2009 Cafeholics Masters
Simulacrum
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
Chief Pixel PusherCafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe WriterCafe RankerMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeInnovative MemberWeb Supporter
Posts: 9875
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: On a Mission

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby josebach » Thu Apr 17, 2008 1:22 pm

Simulacrum wrote:Personally, I think anyone that would prefer to have sex with a 12 year old girl instead of an 18-30 year old woman is out of their ever-loving mind and should be removed from the human race, genitals first.


Sounds like a perfect opportunity to break out my newest invention... the "nuts capacitor".
josebach
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar

Posts: 2036
Joined: 27 Aug 2003
Home Cafe: Football
Location: Tallahassee

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby beatdrum » Thu Apr 17, 2008 3:52 pm

Interesting thread...

Here's a question. If the marriage was completely consensual, with no allegations of rape, would there still be this outcry?
beatdrum
College Coach
College Coach

User avatar

Posts: 342
(Past Year: 1)
Joined: 23 Aug 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Texas Polygamy Situation

Postby Art Vandelay » Thu Apr 17, 2008 4:05 pm

beatdrum wrote:Interesting thread...

Here's a question. If the marriage was completely consensual, with no allegations of rape, would there still be this outcry?

The point that many are making is that a 12-year-old is incapable of consenting to sex with an adult, at least legally. So "consensual" sex between a 12-year-old and a 40-year-old is rape.
Image
Art Vandelay
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

CafeholicFantasy ExpertPick 3 Weekly WinnerLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 5265
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball

PreviousNext

Return to General Talk

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: wslrrwscq and 4 guests

Forums Articles & Tips Sleepers Rankings Leagues


Today's Games
Saturday, Jul. 26
(All times are EST, weather icons show forecast for game time)

Toronto at NY Yankees
(1:05 pm)
St. Louis at Chi Cubs
(4:05 pm)
Washington at Cincinnati
(4:05 pm)
Baltimore at Seattle
(4:10 pm)
Arizona at Philadelphia
(7:05 pm)
Boston at Tampa Bay
(7:10 pm)
indoors
Chi White Sox at Minnesota
(7:10 pm)
NY Mets at Milwaukee
(7:10 pm)
Cleveland at Kansas City
(7:10 pm)
Miami at Houston
(7:10 pm)
San Diego at Atlanta
(7:10 pm)
Oakland at Texas
(8:05 pm)
Pittsburgh at Colorado
(8:10 pm)
Detroit at LA Angels
(9:05 pm)
LA Dodgers at San Francisco
(9:05 pm)

  • Fantasy Baseball
  • Article Submissions
  • Privacy Statement
  • Site Survey 
  • Contact