Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder - Fantasy Baseball Cafe 2015 Fantasy Baseball Cafe
100% Deposit Bonus for Cafe Members!

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby markj11 » Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:24 am

kemper5 wrote:It's funny, some of us think of Morneau who has averaged 30 HR's, 123 RBI's, 93 Runs and a .297 Ave in the last 3 years as a 4th to 5th round guy..To me those are 2nd to 3rd round numbers..Morneau is only 27 years old at the prime of his career and will get his usual 31 HR's, 130 RBI, 95 Runs and close to the .300 Ave again and I'll be happy having him as my 3rd round keeper instead of taking a guy like Teixiera who puts out the exact same stats (31HR, 112 RBI, 95 Runs, .297 Ave over a 3 year span) and drafting him late 1st, early 2nd rd. Teixeira and Morneau are the same player..Look at the Averages of both players, they are identical with Teix getting a few less RBI


I see about 12-15 difference in HR ceilings.
I ain't askin' nobody for nothin, If I can't get it on my own. - Charlie Daniels
markj11
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar

Posts: 2112
Joined: 3 Apr 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Wright here

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby kemper5 » Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:45 am

There basically the same player. Teix is a 34 HR, 115 RBI, .297 guy. While Teix may get 2-3 more HR's, Morneau will get 12-15 more RBI and go 30 HR, 130 RBI, .297..I'll take 4th to 5th rd Morneau in low profile Minny to late 1st to 2nd rd Teix in pressure cooker NY
kemper5
Major League Manager
Major League Manager


Posts: 1726
Joined: 22 Jul 2004
Home Cafe: Football

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby bigh0rt » Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:52 am

Just a reminder that this thread is from March '08, so anything said before the bump isn't taking this past season into account...

162 game Averages:
.281/29 HR/116 RBI/87 R/1 SB
.290/36 HR/121 RBI/101 R/2 SB

It looks like there's at least some semblance of a reason one guy is taken ahead of the other, which, according to the MDP, Teixeira is currently 13.96, and Morneau is 23.17. Those seem like reasonable places for both of them to me.

Keep in mind in the past two seasons Teixeira has been traded from the AL to the NL and then back to the AL again.
Image
bigh0rt
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterGraphics ExpertMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeInnovative MemberCafe MusketeerWeb SupporterPick 3 Weekly Winner
Posts: 24818
(Past Year: 322)
Joined: 3 Jun 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Crowding The Plate

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby Curtis Pride » Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:23 pm

kemper5 wrote:There basically the same player. Teix is a 34 HR, 115 RBI, .297 guy. While Teix may get 2-3 more HR's, Morneau will get 12-15 more RBI and go 30 HR, 130 RBI, .297..I'll take 4th to 5th rd Morneau in low profile Minny to late 1st to 2nd rd Teix in pressure cooker NY


Wow, how much as fantasy baseball perverted actual baseball value for anyone to actually say that Morneau and Teixeira are basically the same player.

Teixieira is SIGNIFICANTLY better than Morneau at baseball. He is way better offensively and so much better defensively that it makes me weep.

I realize you were just comparing them in fantasy categories and not factoring in walks and defense and such, I'm just commenting on how much better Teixeira actually is.
Curtis Pride
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar

Posts: 1363
(Past Year: 5)
Joined: 19 May 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby kemper5 » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:05 pm

Curtis Pride wrote:
kemper5 wrote:There basically the same player. Teix is a 34 HR, 115 RBI, .297 guy. While Teix may get 2-3 more HR's, Morneau will get 12-15 more RBI and go 30 HR, 130 RBI, .297..I'll take 4th to 5th rd Morneau in low profile Minny to late 1st to 2nd rd Teix in pressure cooker NY


Wow, how much as fantasy baseball perverted actual baseball value for anyone to actually say that Morneau and Teixeira are basically the same player.

Teixieira is SIGNIFICANTLY better than Morneau at baseball. He is way better offensively and so much better defensively that it makes me weep.

I realize you were just comparing them in fantasy categories and not factoring in walks and defense and such, I'm just commenting on how much better Teixeira actually is.


Im just going by the offensive averages over the last 3 years, I really can't see how Teixiera is a Way better hitter offensively

Morneau- 30 HR's, 123 RBI's, 93 Runs and a .297 Ave ..3 year average
Teix- 31HR, 112 RBI, 95 Runs, .297 Ave ..3 year average

I dunno, maybe Im blind.. 8-o
kemper5
Major League Manager
Major League Manager


Posts: 1726
Joined: 22 Jul 2004
Home Cafe: Football

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby byfrcp » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:11 pm

He just isn't a sexy pick. A first baseman playing in Minnesota who is nice and quiet. When I think about Justin I think of a plain player. He still puts up the numbers regardless.
byfrcp
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
Eagle EyePick 3 Weekly WinnerLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 2204
(Past Year: 1)
Joined: 19 Jun 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Massachusetts

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby Curtis Pride » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:14 pm

Like I said, you are only talking about fantasy. And you are only talking about the standard fantasy categories not his "offensive categories". Texiera consistently has a 30-40 point edge in OBP and a 50ish edge in SLG - those are pretty huge differences.

According to fangraphs (honestly, the best baseball site on earth), they compare thusly over the past 3 years.

Batting
Teixiera: 35 runs
Morneau: 25 runs.

Which is a difference about 2-3 wins per year.
Curtis Pride
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar

Posts: 1363
(Past Year: 5)
Joined: 19 May 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby DaShiz23 » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:35 pm

I posted something similiar in the 2009 Projections thread. I appreciate this being bumped up. I just do not feel good about the idea of Morneau being my 2nd or 3rd selection.
Image
DaShiz23
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
Cafeholic
Posts: 3412
(Past Year: 67)
Joined: 3 Apr 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Don't call it a comeback.

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby kemper5 » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:47 pm

Below is the lastest 5x5 Mock Draft Central rankings, Morneau is averaging being drafted 18th and Teix 15th..That's about right. Id take Justins bat over anyone below him in that draft. You want a 30 HR, 125 RBI, 95 Run, .300 guy..It's Morneau plain and simple..It's all in the #'s people, he should of had his 2nd MVP last year, but spunky Pad's won it..

Player Pos Team ADP
1) Hanley Ramirez SS FLA
2) Alex Rodriguez 3B NYY
3) Albert Pujols 1B STL
4) David Wright 3B NYM
5) Jose Reyes SS NYM
6) Grady Sizemore OF CLE
7) Miguel Cabrera 1B DET
8) Jimmy Rollins SS PHI
9) Josh Hamilton OF TEX
10) Ryan Braun OF MIL
11) Ian Kinsler 2B TEX
12) Ryan Howard 1B PHI
13) Matt Holliday OF OAK
14) Mark Teixeira 1B NYY
15) Lance Berkman 1B HOU
16) Johan Santana SP NYM
17) B.J. Upton OF TB
18) Justin Morneau 1B MIN
19) Evan Longoria 3B TB
20) Manny Ramirez OF LA
21) Chase Utley 2B PHI
22) Alfonso Soriano OF CHC
23) Carlos Beltran OF NYM
24) Prince Fielder 1B MIL
25) Ichiro Suzuki OF SEA
26) Carlos Lee OF HOU
27) Dustin Pedroia 2B BOS
28) Tim Lincecum SP SF
29) Carl Crawford OF TB
30) Brandon Phillips 2B CIN
31) Aramis Ramirez 3B CHC
32) CC Sabathia SP NYY
33) Jason Bay OF BOS
34) Nick Markakis OF BAL
35) Adrian Gonzalez 1B SD
36) Carlos Quentin OF CHW
kemper5
Major League Manager
Major League Manager


Posts: 1726
Joined: 22 Jul 2004
Home Cafe: Football

Re: Justin Morneau is not even a 5th rounder

Postby Curtis Pride » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:58 pm

kemper5 wrote:It's Morneau plain and simple..It's all in the #'s people, he should of had his 2nd MVP last year, but spunky Pad's won it..

He never should have even won his first MVP award. Mauer was worth way more to his team than Morneau. Way way more. Mauer had a higher OPS, played a much tougher defensive position, and played it exceptionally well.
Curtis Pride
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar

Posts: 1363
(Past Year: 5)
Joined: 19 May 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

PreviousNext

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: unioreimi and 10 guests

Forums Articles & Tips Sleepers Rankings Leagues


  • Fantasy Baseball
  • Article Submissions
  • Privacy Statement
  • Site Survey 
  • Contact