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Drafting players on the same team

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Re: Drafting players on the same team

Postby markj11 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:23 pm

Matthias wrote:
markj11 wrote:It was awsome having Tom Brady and Randy Moss.

Different sport; different situation; and it was awesome because they both set NFL records. That would've been awesome if they had played on different conferences. Really, this all should drop... everyone's made their point. Nobody's mind is going to be changed any more.


Yeah, I was pointing out that in Football it is a good strategy but not baseball.
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Re: Drafting players on the same team

Postby Fade2White12 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:44 pm

Ernie Whitt wrote:
Here is the difference:

On April 1st, A-Rod goes 2-4 with 0HRs, 3RBIs, and 1 Run.
On April 1st, Lowell goes 2-4 with 0HRs, 3RBIs, and 1 Run.
On April 1st, Ortiz goes 2-4 with 0HRS, 1RBI and 3 runs.
And, for the sake of argument, assume Ortiz and Lowell knocked each other in for their respective runs and RBIS.

If you own Lowell and Ortiz your total for the day is:
4-8, 0HR, 4 RBI, 4 Runs

If you own A-Rod and Ortiz your total for the day is:
4-8, 0HR, 4 RBI, 4 Runs - exactly the same.

But we're not talking so much as your bottom line as limiting your opponents' bottom lines.

If you own A-Rod and Ortiz (and one of your opponents own Lowell), they're getting the benefit of Lowell's stats which were a direct by-product of Ortiz's stats. Same thing with the players who got the benefit of A-Rod's stats. It's a domino effect.

By owning A-Rod and Ortiz, in addition to your 4 runs and RBIs, you created 4 runs and RBIs for other players in your league - the people who own Lowell and whoever A-Rod knocked in.

But by owning Lowell and Ortiz, you still get your 4 runs and 4 rbis, but have created nothing for anyone else in the rest of the league.


Obviously you can create hypotheticals like this, but it really doesn't help explain your theory - especially since very infrequently would an entire game's stats be created by only a select few individuals on a team. Even so, although Ortiz and Lowell might have created, themselves, all of those statistics, every single fantasy stat has a positive or negative effect on another player. Every hit is an increase in WHIP for the pitcher, almost every Run is an RBI for someone, and is a hit on ERA for a pitcher. Every K for a pitcher is a hit on the batter's BA, etc. By owning Lowell and Ortiz, you may be "preventing" their stats from being accumulated by another owner, but in turn each owner's players are preventing you from accumulating their statistics. The fact that you might not have any Rockies on your teams disqualifies you from benefiting from their statistics. Again, it depends on the caliber of the player in regards to fantasy - therefore their team, ballpark, competition, etc. So in your hyopthetical, while you may accumulate the same statistics having Ortiz/Lowell vs Rodriguez/Lowell and you thus keep any other team from accumulating the stats of Ortiz, having ARod and Lowell allow you to accumulate the statistics previously prohibited to you. Simply having two+ players on the same team does not provide any offensive or defensive advantages.
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Re: Drafting players on the same team

Postby Grouperman941 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:53 pm

Fade2White12 wrote:Simply having two+ players on the same team does not provide any offensive or defensive advantages.



Nice post. Like someone said in here earlier, The only time this would be an advantage is when you have a couple of players on a powerful offense (Yankees, Sox, Phillies, Mets). But also like someone else said, these things should already be accounted for in the projections.

I would look out for it, and in a tie-break situation, I would like to have someone batting right ahead or behind a stud I already have. It makes it a lot more fun to watch the live scoring when one HR bumps a bunch of my daily stats. :-)

I think your theory is an illusion, though. It only seems like what you are saying is true because you are focused on your players.
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Re: Drafting players on the same team

Postby Ender » Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:00 pm

Ernie Whitt wrote:
Here is the difference:

On April 1st, A-Rod goes 2-4 with 0HRs, 3RBIs, and 1 Run.
On April 1st, Lowell goes 2-4 with 0HRs, 3RBIs, and 1 Run.
On April 1st, Ortiz goes 2-4 with 0HRS, 1RBI and 3 runs.
And, for the sake of argument, assume Ortiz and Lowell knocked each other in for their respective runs and RBIS.

If you own Lowell and Ortiz your total for the day is:
4-8, 0HR, 4 RBI, 4 Runs

If you own A-Rod and Ortiz your total for the day is:
4-8, 0HR, 4 RBI, 4 Runs - exactly the same.

But we're not talking so much as your bottom line as limiting your opponents' bottom lines.

If you own A-Rod and Ortiz (and one of your opponents own Lowell), they're getting the benefit of Lowell's stats which were a direct by-product of Ortiz's stats. Same thing with the players who got the benefit of A-Rod's stats. It's a domino effect.

By owning A-Rod and Ortiz, in addition to your 4 runs and RBIs, you created 4 runs and RBIs for other players in your league - the people who own Lowell and whoever A-Rod knocked in.

But by owning Lowell and Ortiz, you still get your 4 runs and 4 rbis, but have created nothing for anyone else in the rest of the league.


We get what you are saying, it just is meaningless. It doesn't matter that you 'don't give anyone else stats', they are still going to get the stats from their own players. You aren't somehow denying them anything.
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Re: Drafting players on the same team

Postby Fade2White12 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:06 pm

Grouperman941 wrote:
Fade2White12 wrote:Simply having two+ players on the same team does not provide any offensive or defensive advantages.



Nice post. Like someone said in here earlier, The only time this would be an advantage is when you have a couple of players on a powerful offense (Yankees, Sox, Phillies, Mets). But also like someone else said, these things should already be accounted for in the projections.

I would look out for it, and in a tie-break situation, I would like to have someone batting right ahead or behind a stud I already have. It makes it a lot more fun to watch the live scoring when one HR bumps a bunch of my daily stats. :-)

I think your theory is an illusion, though. It only seems like what you are saying is true because you are focused on your players.


^Bolded sentence -- something I also said. B-)

But you're right, especially in regards to excitement. I'm a regular homer, and really for several teams (normally the Tigers but others as well). On my latest team, I have Soriano, Ramirez, and Zambrano (I'm a closet Cubs fan). It definitely makes things more fun when watching a Cubs game, but I derive no statistical advantage by having them all. The definitive term you used was "illusion" because that is precisely what it is.
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Re: Drafting players on the same team

Postby Matthias » Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:15 pm

Maybe he just thinks that someone is drinking his milkshake... Eli, is it you? Is it you, Eli?

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Re: Drafting players on the same team

Postby Ernie Whitt » Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:07 pm

Thanks for the responses guys, the serious and the smart-assed. I think the clincher that did it for me was whoever said that although by having players on the same team means that you're not producing stats for any other owners, it also means that they aren't producing anything for you. In the end it evens out. Essentially the theory doesn't help you, but it can hurt you.
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