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Arod for Wright Veto

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Arod for Wright Veto

Postby sox 06 » Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:00 pm

Is this trade worthy of a veto? It was proposed to me and my league vetoed it.

David Wright/Mariano Rivera/Jonathan Broxton
FOR
Arod/Matt Cain/ Joakim Soria
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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby stevethumb » Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:08 pm

ridiculous veto !!! how do any trades get passed in your league ?!?!--i have side A at $74 of value and side B at $76
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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby sox 06 » Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:12 pm

stevethumb wrote:ridiculous veto !!! how do any trades get passed in your league ?!?!--i have side A at $74 of value and side B at $76

I don't have a clue why they veto so much. I made a thread a few days back where my league vetoed Victorino for Ellsbury. I put a message up asking for the people who vetoed this trade to tell why they vetoed it.
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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby Alcooo » Mon Feb 25, 2008 12:42 am

You seem to be dealing with very difficult owners. I see no reason to veto that trade.

The more unknowledged fan may see Wright and Rivera being traded for A-Rod and two unknowns though. I guess it depends on the knowledge of your league's other owners.
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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby commence8 » Mon Feb 25, 2008 1:55 am

Again, find a new league.
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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby Matthias » Mon Feb 25, 2008 1:34 pm

I think Side A is significantly better. If I was in a league where you could vote to veto, I probably would. If I was in a league where I was commissioner, I would let it go. The difference comes out of the different duties that entail between a fellow owner who is only asked to use their own judgment and a commissioner who is supposed to look out for the best interests of the league.

Rationale for voting veto: A-Rod and Wright are pretty close... people here think Wright is the #2 pick to A-Rod's #1. And after that, the two others just don't match up.... Rivera is a stud and has been for over a decade and Broxton is looking really, really good as a young reliever and future closer. On the other side, Cain has yet to really bust out and be more than a decent fantasy starter and Soria has only had one year in the bigs, didn't look that great, and doesn't project out nearly as well as Broxton. Other relevant factors are how long the league has been around, what trades have been vetoed in the past, if the other owner really knows what they're doing, and the relationship between the two owners so as to infer whether or not there's some monkey business going on.

But if you give people the right to vote against you, don't be surprised and indignant when they do.
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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby talan37 » Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:41 pm

I don't see it Mathias.

Joakim is more valuable than broxton in most peoples minds. They had very similar numbers last year and Soria is a closer, Broxton is a MR and while everyone would like him to become the closer, Saito doesn't appear to be going anywhere with his 1.4 Era. That makes Soria a greater quantity than Broxton. Keep in mind here that broxton has only "done it" for 2 years, while Soria has done it for 1. Both are supported by there minor league numbers. Is broxton better? probably...but that doesn't really matter since as an actual closer if they put up similar numbers Soria is far more valuable, and unless something major happens Broxton is relegated to MR.


Arod is Greater than Wright. Wright is a great player, certainly getting better, but Arod was unparalled last year and his career yearly average is better than any single year wright has put up. If there is a fantasy player alive who would rather have wright than arod who doesn't bleed blue and orange I would be surprised.

Mariano is/was a hell of a closer, and can probably be relied on to be a very good closer, and if Cain doesn't breakout like many expect him to do, then he will be worth more.

However I don't think Mariano over Cain unbalances Arod over wright, and Soria over Broxton. The rankings from most sites(including the cafe) seem to bear this out.(Soria > Broxton, Arod > Wright, Mariano > Cain)

Until Broxton becomes something other than a good middle reliever stuck behind a very good closer he simply has very low value.

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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby Matthias » Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:54 pm

The only reason Soria > Broxton is b/c those are draft rankings based off of a redraft league. If teams are doing trades right now, I'm assuming this is a keeper league in which case Broxton > Soria. Don't make any mistake: Broxton is the closer of the future. Saito has been amazing but he's 38 years old.

I'm looking at Broxton and Soria's minor-league numbers and Broxton's is really better. First, Broxton averages more than a K an inning; Soria less than 1. Soria's ERA from 2005 to 2006 was around 4; Broxton's around 3. At the limited innings Broxton did do in AAA he had an ERA of 0.00. And Soria's first year in the majors wasn't as good as either of Broxton's first two.

Soria will have more value if he stays as the closer in KC and he doesn't blow up and Broxton doesn't get the closing job in LA. But I'm thinking at least one of those things will happen in the next 2 years so Broxton is the superior long-term pick.

I also see Wright closing the gap on A-Rod over the next couple of years.

So let me rephase: in a redraft, the trade isn't vetoable. If this is a keeper league, as I suspect, I would vote to veto as an owner, but not as a commissioner.
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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby commence8 » Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:12 pm

...I hope my league never turns into this...

Vetoes are for absolutely ridiculous trades and collusion. The fact that there is an argument is enough to not be a veto.

Again, find a new league...this will only get more frustrating as people get more and more bitter about past trades that did and did not go through.
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Re: Arod for Wright Veto

Postby sox 06 » Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:36 pm

I'll be getting another team very soon anyways so this will become my "second" team. This isn't a keeper, but the reason Broxton is owned is because my league counts HOLDS and he is a pretty darn good holds guy and his other stats are good as well.
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