under 24 pitcher rankings

[acsguitar]

How are you guys not including Jimenez especially since he put on 15 pounds of muscle in the offseason

[MTUCache]

How are you guys not including Jimenez especially since he put on 15 pounds of muscle in the offseason

nobody asked me too... gimme a minute and I will.

[jake_harv88]

for 2008 fantasy

1. Scott Kazmir (I hate you Steve Phillips I hate you)
I'm ok now
2. Cole Hamels
3. Matt Cain
4. Felix Hernandez
5. Tim Lincecum
6. Francisco Liriano (I have him at 24, might be wrong)
7. Fausto Carmona
8. Jonathan Broxton
9. Yovani Gallardo
10. Chad Billingsley
11. Joakim Soria
12. Phil Hughes
13. Joba Chamberlain
14. Carlos Villanueva
15. Kevin Slowey
16. Matt Garza
17. Ian Kennedy

If you are referring to the Scott Kazmir trade as your reasoning for hating Steve Phillips, remember that Jim Duquette was the GM at the time. Jim Duquette's most recent job was with the Orioles. He has recently been let go. Good job he did.

Anyways, any other reason for hating him I totally agree...

[acsguitar]

How are you guys not including Jimenez especially since he put on 15 pounds of muscle in the offseason

nobody asked me too... gimme a minute and I will.

Sorry I thought it was a ranking and not someone asking for rankings

Whoops. I think I've been here to long I tend to speed read some threads

[MTUCache]

I've got Jimenez at a 10/4.00/1.30/140 season with around 150 IP... if those aren't your numbers then you'll obviously have to adjust.

That puts him at around a negative 4.0 in this group...

Better than Garza and Sonnanstine, but definitely not on my radar unless I'm missing something.

(Let me guess... you've got him down for a 15/3.40/1.30/190 season)... that would put him just ahead of Gallardo. But, like I said, I'm not seeing those numbers unless I'm missing something (which I definitely could be).

[acsguitar]

I've got Jimenez at a 10/4.00/1.30/140 season with around 150 IP... if those aren't your numbers then you'll obviously have to adjust.

That puts him at around a negative 4.0 in this group...

Better than Garza and Sonnanstine, but definitely not on my radar unless I'm missing something.

Man I assume he gets more then 150 IP. but other then that I think the Era and Whip are correct. I think the K's might be low.

My just projecting on watching him play would be.

12-8/4.20/1.35/189 201 IP

Again not a super stud but better then some of those people on the list IMO just from watching him.

I think your projections seem good for him except for the IP

[J35J]

Hamels (Hamels and Kaz are interchangeable for me, Kaz has a much higher upside but he is also more inconsistant, while both have injury histories)
Kazmir

Cain (Cain, Felix, Lincy, Gallardo are all very close together for me, with Carmona just a tick below them)
Felix
Lincecum
Gallardo
Carmona

Billingsley
Buchholz (Love this kid)
Joba

Greinke
Hughes (Just a gut feeling he'll be streaky this year and will throw 20-30 less IP than Greinke)

Garza (has much more to work on than anyone else in the list)

[J35J]

How are you guys not including Jimenez especially since he put on 15 pounds of muscle in the offseason

I actually like Morales more than Jimenez.

[acsguitar]

How are you guys not including Jimenez especially since he put on 15 pounds of muscle in the offseason

I actually like Morales more than Jimenez.

In the long run talent wise maybe. However, Morales seems fragile mentally while Jimenez seems very strong.

[Scooter1027]

7. Gallardo - i like his stuff and command right now but i fear his weight, and he looks more like an innings eater to me

AKA John Sickels thinks these things and you're ripping off his opinion http://www.minorleagueball.com/story/2008/2/5/134748/4138.

What he did last year was no fluke in my view. So the question is, can he stay healthy? He's been remarkably durable as a pro. Listed at 6-1, 210, he doesn't have the prototype 6-4, 210 pound pitcher's body and may have to watch his weight as he gets older. But he repeats his delivery well, and appears to have a resilient arm. I don't think his injury risk is any higher than it is for any other pitcher his age, and perhaps it's a bit lower.

I could see Gallardo being a pitcher who is best in his early-to-mid-20s, then gradually fading as he approaches 30. My guess is that his best years will be in the next five, and that eventually he'll become "just" an inning-eating starter. Assuming he stays healthy, Gallardo should be recognized as Number One starter and among the best pitchers in baseball in the 2008-2012 window, but that by 2014 he'll be more of an inning-eater type. An early peak, followed by a very gradual decline in other words. No massive sudden shock injury, but rather a slow loss of effectiveness as his arm wears down.

Sickels also mentions that Gallardo is set up for a 5-6 year window of very good pitching before he hits this presumed decline (which I don't buy, but who knows). So for this year anyway, I think very highly of Gallardo. He should put up good ERA/WHIP/K numbers while also being a team that should support him with plenty of offense.