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MAFIAA at it again

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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby JTWood » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:10 pm

AussieDodger wrote:If it is such a "naughty" thing to do, then why is it so easy/legal to get and have our "burglary tools"
You know, CD burner (legal), computer that plays and can modify music (legal), file-sharing sites (still on internet, if they were such a big deal there would be none), blank cds (legal).

Are you purposely ignoring common sense?

Each of those items isn't illegal because they have perfectly legal uses.
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby Tavish » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:16 pm

Madison wrote:The utter lack of common sense of the kids stealing the music and not realizing it is illegal is the worst thing about the entire situation. And those that think it's no big deal to steal music would be second on my list (almost #1). Remember the last thread about this? Some crazy high percentage of kids said they didn't know it was illegal. That's just sad that the world is in such a place. Ok, off my soap box too now. :-b


The tactics that the RIAA has been using are absolutely deplorable IMO. How they have managed to avoid RICO charges so far speaks volumes to how money and power will let you get away with just about anything in the US these days. I don't have sympathy for a pirate when they are caught and held responsible for their actions. I do have sympathy when the repercussions are so far out of bounds with the actual crime. The 18th Amendment is still valid in America, except when it gets in the way of powerful lobbyists.
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby Madison » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:40 pm

Tavish wrote:I don't have sympathy for a pirate when they are caught and held responsible for their actions. I do have sympathy when the repercussions are so far out of bounds with the actual crime. The 18th Amendment is still valid in America, except when it gets in the way of powerful lobbyists.


I don't, at least not typically, but that's not news or anything :-D . Simple matter for me. The country is spiraling downward into a rotting cesspool and is totally out of control. Things are not getting better and they are not going to until punishments start actually being a deterrent to crime. Punishments shouldn't be a trade-off where someone says, ok, I'm going to steal music and the worst that can happen is I get hit with a $100 fine. The punishment needs to be strong and severe enough to prevent someone from choosing to break the law. Otherwise, the law is nothing more than a joke, which is the current situation. Goes for anything. The joke the death penalty has become, the DWI/DUI punishments where drivers with 10 convictions are still on the roads, etc. Music theft certainly shouldn't be a huge priority or anything, but at some point, punishments that are harsh and severe enough to actually deter crime have to be instituted across the board. Nothing else will save this country. We're not simply going to wake up one day where everyone is a good person who doesn't break the law. If this is one of the first steps at making punishments actually be punishments, be what punishments are designed to do, and make people think twice before breaking the law, then I welcome it.

And what does prohibition have to do with this? Or did I get confused somewhere. :-o
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby AussieDodger » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:47 pm

Madison wrote:And what does prohibition have to do with this? Or did I get confused somewhere. :-o


Because that's another example of the govt. trying to ban something that they shouldn't.
Just like this. ;-D
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby Madison » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:53 pm

AussieDodger wrote:
Madison wrote:And what does prohibition have to do with this? Or did I get confused somewhere. :-o


Because that's another example of the govt. trying to ban something that they shouldn't.
Just like this. ;-D


Banning a substance versus stealing someone else's original work are two totally different things.

Arguing about banning drugs (pot, coke, meth, etc) makes more sense if prohibition is going to be used in the argument. Or even the whole smoking thing. Fort Worth, Texas just instituted the no smoking in public places thing on January 1st. Dallas and Arlington (I'm in Arlington - smack dab between those two cities) had already put laws in place against smoking in public. And smoking is legal, so that's really the best item when trying to compare something to prohibition. Arguing those kinds of things with prohibition makes sense. Not stealing original work that someone else created. Doesn't fit at all.
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby JTWood » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:59 pm

I think he meant 8th, not 18th guys.
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby AussieDodger » Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:00 pm

Madison wrote:Banning a substance versus stealing someone else's original work are two totally different things.


It's sharing not stealing.

Did they do anything about this in the 80s/90s with tapes?
Only now that they can log what's happening and "big brother it up".

If someone was copying painted art and giving it to you would you accept it?
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby Madison » Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:15 pm

JTWood wrote:I think he meant 8th, not 18th guys.


I'm sure he did. ;-) But "cruel and unusual" is different for everyone. There are no set guidelines as to what qualifies and what doesn't. And in today's society, it takes something towards what would be generally perceived as extreme to get attention. Which is exactly the way things need to start changing.

AussieDodger wrote:
Madison wrote:Banning a substance versus stealing someone else's original work are two totally different things.


It's sharing not stealing.

Did they do anything about this in the 80s/90s with tapes?
Only now that they can log what's happening and "big brother it up".

If someone was copying painted art and giving it to you would you accept it?


Perfect example JT. Even now, with the laws clearly out there, some think stealing is "sharing". *shakes head*

As to the question, no, they didn't worry themselves when it came to tapes in the 80's. There wasn't that big of a drain financially on the music market. Now it's grown to such proportions that the law has to be enforced. Like the smoking thing I mentioned earlier. Smoking is legal, but look at all the steps they are taking to eliminate it from society in this day and age. Raising the penalty for those selling cigs to kids, banning it in public places, etc. Just because the government didn't immediately act on something, that doesn't mean it's "ok". Stealing music is still stealing. And due to the levels it has reached, punishments are being enforced. Same for movies and video games, so it's not like just music is being picked on or anything.

Fake copies of painted art? Nah, I've got no interest in that.
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby AussieDodger » Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:23 pm

Madison wrote:Perfect example JT. Even now, with the laws clearly out there, some think stealing is "sharing". *shakes head*


But that's what is happening. I am giving someone a song and they are giving me one back.
Sharing or trading music.
I haven't pinched it from anywhere.

That would be like saying I pinched photos from google images, some of them are copyrighted aren't they?
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Re: MAFIAA at it again

Postby Madison » Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:30 pm

AussieDodger wrote:
Madison wrote:Perfect example JT. Even now, with the laws clearly out there, some think stealing is "sharing". *shakes head*


But that's what is happening. I am giving someone a song and they are giving me one back.
Sharing or trading music.
I haven't pinched it from anywhere.

That would be like saying I pinched photos from google images, some of them are copyrighted aren't they?


That's the thing though. You're giving something you don't own. You own the disk/MP3/record or whatever, but you do not own the rights to copy it and give it away. Can't do it with movies or video games either and those are the exact same things. Tavish is much better at explaining this part than I am though.
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Yes doctor, there will be a war.
Yes doctor, there will be blood.....
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