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Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby Matthias » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:44 pm

deerayfan072 wrote:Correct the City owns it. The Rays are going to find the buyer and developer for the City and the excess profit will be used for the stadium, is how I understand it

So the city is going to sell off a valuable asset, use that money for a new stadium for an MLB team, but the new stadium isn't costing the residents of Tampa anything? How does that balance sheet abacus work?
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby thedude » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:58 pm

Matthias wrote:
deerayfan072 wrote:Correct the City owns it. The Rays are going to find the buyer and developer for the City and the excess profit will be used for the stadium, is how I understand it

So the city is going to sell off a valuable asset, use that money for a new stadium for an MLB team, but the new stadium isn't costing the residents of Tampa anything? How does that balance sheet abacus work?


The only party that ever profits from a new stadium is the team. Extensive economic analysis of this issue has been conducted recently. Any public money (in this case $350,000,000) is a waste. The tax dollars (even taxes on tourists) could go to other, better, uses in the city of St. Petersburg.

But good for the Rays, getting the city to foot the bill... ;-D
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby deerayfan072 » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:59 pm

Matthias wrote:
deerayfan072 wrote:Correct the City owns it. The Rays are going to find the buyer and developer for the City and the excess profit will be used for the stadium, is how I understand it

So the city is going to sell off a valuable asset, use that money for a new stadium for an MLB team, but the new stadium isn't costing the residents of Tampa anything? How does that balance sheet abacus work?



Because it was not giving them any money in the first place. They are going to replace the money they would have been getting had the Rays stayed in there lease for the next 22 years and using the leftover money to build the new stadium. So really the excess is money the city would not have unless the Rays were to move and they would only move if they had a new stadium.
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby deerayfan072 » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:01 pm

thedude wrote:
Matthias wrote:
deerayfan072 wrote:Correct the City owns it. The Rays are going to find the buyer and developer for the City and the excess profit will be used for the stadium, is how I understand it

So the city is going to sell off a valuable asset, use that money for a new stadium for an MLB team, but the new stadium isn't costing the residents of Tampa anything? How does that balance sheet abacus work?


The only party that ever profits from a new stadium is the team. Extensive economic analysis of this issue has been conducted recently. Any public money (in this case $350,000,000) is a waste. The tax dollars (even taxes on tourists) could go to other, better, uses in the city of St. Petersburg.

But good for the Rays, getting the city to foot the bill... ;-D


while I agree the money could go to other things, you have to realize the money that will be in fluxed into the city once they open the area around the stadium. It is going to be shops, resteraunts, etc. that will revitalize that area
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby Matthias » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:26 pm

deerayfan072 wrote:
Matthias wrote:
deerayfan072 wrote:Correct the City owns it. The Rays are going to find the buyer and developer for the City and the excess profit will be used for the stadium, is how I understand it

So the city is going to sell off a valuable asset, use that money for a new stadium for an MLB team, but the new stadium isn't costing the residents of Tampa anything? How does that balance sheet abacus work?

Because it was not giving them any money in the first place. They are going to replace the money they would have been getting had the Rays stayed in there lease for the next 22 years and using the leftover money to build the new stadium. So really the excess is money the city would not have unless the Rays were to move and they would only move if they had a new stadium.

I see. But still, previously, they still held the remainder at the end of the lease, even if the property was going to be tied up for the next 22 years. Now they're selling that off. So it's not costless.

And I dislike the idea that simply improving property values is good for the city. Sure, there's a higher tax base to collect on, but the overall effect is fairly negative, simply a wealth transfer from everyone in the city to the individuals who own property nearby. Now, if the city held a mass of land and let a major league team use part of it for their stadium and then recoup'ed their investment by the appreciated value on the city's own land, that would be a different story. But of course, that never happens.
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby GotowarMissAgnes » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:36 pm

deerayfan072 wrote:
while I agree the money could go to other things, you have to realize the money that will be in fluxed into the city once they open the area around the stadium. It is going to be shops, resteraunts, etc. that will revitalize that area


No, in fact, that influx doesn't happen. There have been numerous studies of this, and there is no evidence that public funding of stadiums contributes one dollar more to total economic growth in an area than any other public investment, or even than allowing taxpayers to keep their own money and spend it as they wish.
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby deerayfan072 » Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:52 pm

GotowarMissAgnes wrote:
deerayfan072 wrote:
while I agree the money could go to other things, you have to realize the money that will be in fluxed into the city once they open the area around the stadium. It is going to be shops, resteraunts, etc. that will revitalize that area


No, in fact, that influx doesn't happen. There have been numerous studies of this, and there is no evidence that public funding of stadiums contributes one dollar more to total economic growth in an area than any other public investment, or even than allowing taxpayers to keep their own money and spend it as they wish.


Right, but again there is no new tax so there would be no effect on the taxpayers and there would not be anything else there if they dont make the stadium because it is the Rays ST field right now. The whole area is going to be redone with a new shopping center done by a new developer, a park, and a bunch of other things. I just can't see how having something there rather than not will not add to the city. :-?
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby RyanK » Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:32 pm

I like the activeness the Rays are taking, it seems they are finally starting to try.

They have a pretty decent fan base and only growing, two of my friends who dont even follow baseball, one being from kuwait just bought a new rays hat. Tampa itself is growing and actually a very nice area, i like what theyre doing with the development around the stadium, as there are already a few places in Tampa similarly designed.

deeray mentioned how the Lighting are in a nice developed area called Channelside, which is waterfront but not the stadium itself, with bars, shops, a movie theater, and a pretty nice disparity of resturaunts.

I like ;-D

P.S. i though that on the top right corner it said "delmons landing" when i first looked at it..
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby deerayfan072 » Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:47 pm

RyanK wrote:I like the activeness the Rays are taking, it seems they are finally starting to try.

They have a pretty decent fan base and only growing, two of my friends who dont even follow baseball, one being from kuwait just bought a new rays hat. Tampa itself is growing and actually a very nice area, i like what theyre doing with the development around the stadium, as there are already a few places in Tampa similarly designed.

deeray mentioned how the Lighting are in a nice developed area called Channelside, which is waterfront but not the stadium itself, with bars, shops, a movie theater, and a pretty nice disparity of resturaunts.

I like ;-D

P.S. i though that on the top right corner it said "delmons landing" when i first looked at it..


:-b not anymore ;-) :-b
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Re: Rays Plan For New Stadium; Not Weather

Postby JTWood » Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:49 pm

acsguitar wrote:
StlSluggers wrote:
brewcrew4you wrote:I don't think a foot higher sea level in 100 years is going to impact the stadium that much. :-?

A foot of water can often spread miles inland in low-lying areas.

A few inches of water can be devastating in the wrong place.



Did you switch political affiliation?

Why? Because conservatively-minded individuals shouldn't be able to grasp liberal talking points?
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