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How well do you know your ASA Softball?

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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby Lofunzo » Sat Sep 08, 2007 2:43 am

Tavish.......I want to bump this up because we had a situation in our championship. We had a runner on 3rd, 1 out. The hitter hit a grounder to 2nd. The runner on 3rd skooted off of the base, the fielder threw to 1st, and the runner went home. When the throw went to 1st, the batter slid and broke up the play. He was out but he slid and allowed the runner at 3rd to score. They originally credited the run but said that he "interfered with allowing the 1st baseman to make a play at home" on the runner. I argued that this was no different than breaking up a DP at first. Thoughts?? This is ISA.
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby theclefe » Sat Sep 08, 2007 7:25 pm

It is my understanding that you are not allowed to break up a double play. I didn't think you were allowed to intentionally take out a fielder in softball. We'll see what Tavish says.
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby stevethumb » Sun Sep 09, 2007 6:33 pm

Lofunzo wrote:Tavish.......I want to bump this up because we had a situation in our championship. We had a runner on 3rd, 1 out. The hitter hit a grounder to 2nd. The runner on 3rd skooted off of the base, the fielder threw to 1st, and the runner went home. When the throw went to 1st, the batter slid and broke up the play. He was out but he slid and allowed the runner at 3rd to score. They originally credited the run but said that he "interfered with allowing the 1st baseman to make a play at home" on the runner. I argued that this was no different than breaking up a DP at first. Thoughts?? This is ISA.
....interference is a judgement call so i would have to see the play to call it BUT....does your league use the double orange/white base at first ? in ASA the batter/runner is required to run to the orange half (which is in foul territory) and the defensive player uses the white (which is in fair)...IF your batter/baserunner did not go DIRECTLY to the orange part of the base then i would say the umpire made the correct call...this is the difference between the runner breaking up the DP at 2nd base and the situation you describe...
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby Tavish » Mon Sep 10, 2007 6:35 pm

Not sure about ISA, but under ASA if the umpire calls the play interference then the run shouldn't count. Also, breaking up a double play isn't legal in ASA.
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby talan37 » Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:18 pm

Rules are very tight in ASA to prevent injury. As such things like "fake tags", and any sort of interference is extremely frowned upon. We are repeatedly told before our games, you have only 3 options: Slide into the bag, give yourself up, or go back. You can not deliberately make contact with a fielder who has the ball for any reason, but by the same token the fielder can't block a bag unless he has the ball. It does at times make for some sticky situations at home plate specifically because many people think you _can_ block the plate before you receive the ball, which is in fact false. Its an issue because the blocking the plate won't be called interference unless you actually run into the guy, but if he does catch it just before you run into him, your most likely going to get called out.

Sliding into first base to keep a 1B from throwing home would almost certainly garner an interference call in the 3 different ASA leagues i have played in.

In regards to the original question... the three leagues i played in over summer, and currently in fall all have frustratingly short out of play lines. In many cases its barely 10-15 feet even in the outfield, basically guaranteeing the majority of foul balls are actually out of play. On all the baseball fields i played on the out of play markers in the OF went out diagonally away from the foul line, on the softball fields they run only a few degrees from paralell. If you did catch it in play, and then ran out of play it is a dead ball and runners should be awarded bases.
Last edited by talan37 on Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby talan37 » Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:22 pm

On a side note, during my game last weekend we were playing a bunch of guys who hadn't played ASA softball before and didn't know a lot of the rules. We play a lot of games after 9pm, and during the fall and spring the outfield conditions can change drastically due to dew on the grass forming around that time, so anything that goes into the outfield gets wet/skips.

There pitcher in an attempt to dry the ball put it on the ground and covered it in a pile of dirt, then picked it up and pitched it without cleaning it off. I complained as it was literally covered in dirt and sand when pitched. Apparently there entire team thought that was an "ok" thing to do. They equated it to "rubbing up" a ball in baseball. Idiots.
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby stevethumb » Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:56 pm

[quote="talan37"] Its an issue because the blocking the plate won't be called interference unless you actually run into the guy, but if he does catch it just before you run into him, your most likely going to get called out.

actually that is obstruction not interference...and you are correct ASA is definitely safety conscious and many of their more recent rules have been directed to avoid contact...ex. double base and no fake tags...the senior ASA softball rules are antiseptic which includes 2 home plates and no sliding at any time
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby Tavish » Fri Sep 14, 2007 7:30 pm

stevethumb wrote:actually that is obstruction not interference...and you are correct ASA is definitely safety conscious and many of their more recent rules have been directed to avoid contact...ex. double base and no fake tags...the senior ASA softball rules are antiseptic which includes 2 home plates and no sliding at any time

The best senior league rule IMO is the overrun rule. I've seen some of them end up halfway into LC field when stretching a single into a double.
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby talan37 » Mon Sep 17, 2007 8:57 am

Sorry, I mean obstruction. In my game on friday night our right fielder caught the ball in foul territory then ran out of play. oops.
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Re: How well do you know your ASA Softball?

Postby talan37 » Thu Sep 20, 2007 9:59 am

I want to add an addendum to the original question, this happened during my game last night.

The same situation, fielder catches a foul ball and then momentum carries him out of play.

The addendum is that it was the "third strike" so the batter was out on the foul ball. I checked through the rulebook quickly, and it specifically states that a "foul tip" third strike is considered a dead ball(regardless of whether the catcher or anyone else catches it), but not specifically refer to an actual foul ball at any time.(As I understand it "foul tips" are defined differently from a standard foul ball)

I did some quick googling and found that in USSSA a foul ball is a dead ball if it is the third strike and runners can't advance on a catch nor can they advance if the ball goes out of play, but the same place doesn't specifically refer to ASA.

I would generally accept how the umpire calls it, but we get a lot of rotating ASA umpires from leagues that have different addendum rules so they screw things up from time to time. This would seem to be maybe the dumbest rule I have encountered in nearly 25 years of sports if you actually get penalized for catching the ball instead of letting it drop(remember the batter is already out)....
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