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Postby stabone76 » Mon Feb 02, 2004 7:18 pm

j7 wrote:
stabone76 wrote:first of all, walking a SB guy isnt the answer (okay i know that wasnt your point) and as far as (pitchers learn a quicker approach to home plate or something) i think that would involve throwing faster and if they could, i like to think they would already be doing it.


well like i said.. i think pierre will do great again. But, if i was a manager or pitching coach .. i would have some of my guys learn a quicker approach to home plate just for guys like pierre (i'm sure there's a few pitchers that he doesn't run on because they are fast to the plate, and some that he loves taking advantage of.. those are the guys i would work on). i would keep trying till they get better at it. i would also try to learn how to make him hit fly balls.. take away the ground-ball singles. i think pierre's running game is that important. he was the catalyst of their offense last year, and was a huge reason they won it all.. so if i could slow that weapon down, i would. teams go out of their way to learn some specialized feilding-shift for Giambi, and even though Giambi's hampered with injury, i still think that had an effect on his production... (especially if EVERY team adopted it, it must be working) .. so i'm just wondering if teams might do something special for Pierre .. i hope not

and Erboes, people hate me for this, but your the exact type of manager i like to veto. you probly make perfectly fair trades, but if theres one that makes you a lock for 1st place.. then i have no choice but to VETO .. i wish more managers would do that (makes it more competitive)


I think its poor sportsmanship to veto just because you cant beat someone, if its a fair trade
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Postby j7 » Mon Feb 02, 2004 7:32 pm

stabone76 wrote:I think its poor sportsmanship to veto just because you cant beat someone, if its a fair trade


i know, i figure most people feel that way... but what do you do when you see a trade that you know 100% is gonna put a team in 1st place for good.. and no trade or FA miracle will save you. do you just give up and start paying attention to your other leagues? i've had some bad experiences in the past.. just watching savy traders dominate..
Last edited by j7 on Mon Feb 02, 2004 7:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Swinger » Mon Feb 02, 2004 7:33 pm

It should be noted that people assume Pierre will steal 65 like last year. It would be realistic to assume less. Because he stole an amazing 44 before the All-star break, and 21 after. In other years, the same split was almost even.
Then again, maybe not. But even if he stole 50, that would be considerably less, right, Erboes?
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Postby stabone76 » Mon Feb 02, 2004 7:59 pm

j7 wrote:
stabone76 wrote:I think its poor sportsmanship to veto just because you cant beat someone, if its a fair trade


i know, i figure most people feel that way... but what do you do when you see a trade that you know 100% is gonna put a team in 1st place for good.. and no trade or FA miracle will save you. do you just give up and start paying attention to your other leagues? i've had some bad experiences in the past.. just watching savy traders dominate..


If you cant win because someone beat you by drafting and trading, maybe you should learn more and draft better, dont cheat and veto something fair, thats so childish... i suppose as a kid, you were the one that just "took my ball and went home" because you couldnt play.

Remind me to never be in a league with you. I hate people that quit when they cant win, then it makes the league unfun for everying. Inactive owners suck.
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Postby Erboes » Mon Feb 02, 2004 8:42 pm

When discussing splits from last season, it's best to keep in mind nearly 60% of all games were played before the break last season. With Pierre, his second half SB pace slowed a bit, but it was still a pace that would have gotten him close to 55.

It is all true though that SB's are affected by things other than a player's talent. If a manager doesn't want you to run you ain't gonna run. Pierre, however, should still be good for at least 50, judging by his numbers under McKeon and probably more if they decide to manufacture runs more this season. That is providing good health, of course.

Since I am in the Cafe Challenge I will not say whether I'm a shrewd trader or not. I will share my philosophy, though: Never, ever trade a player who is playing below expectations. I will hold onto him for dear life before I dump him. It's my biggest strength and my biggest weakness. I held on to Burrell until September to show how stubborn I am. Over all, though, that philosophy has served me very well.
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Postby j7 » Tue Feb 03, 2004 10:06 am

stabone76 wrote:
j7 wrote:
stabone76 wrote:I think its poor sportsmanship to veto just because you cant beat someone, if its a fair trade


i know, i figure most people feel that way... but what do you do when you see a trade that you know 100% is gonna put a team in 1st place for good.. and no trade or FA miracle will save you. do you just give up and start paying attention to your other leagues? i've had some bad experiences in the past.. just watching savy traders dominate..


If you cant win because someone beat you by drafting and trading, maybe you should learn more and draft better, dont cheat and veto something fair, thats so childish... i suppose as a kid, you were the one that just "took my ball and went home" because you couldnt play.

Remind me to never be in a league with you. I hate people that quit when they cant win, then it makes the league unfun for everying. Inactive owners suck.


well dont stick words in my mouth.. i've never quit a league and never will. in my experience, its usually the people that are afraid to veto that become inactive. i feel like i do ok in the drafts, and on the fa wire. but i'm not as savy a trader... (maybe if i take Erboes advice i could get better).. but what i have a problem wih is that in some legues, only the best traders can win. NONE of the other factors in fantasy baseball matter when there is a bully trader around, they don't need to be good at drafting or make a few smart Fa pick-ups to win a league. they have weaknesses too, but will win ONLY because of trading. last year, i saw some clever trades go through without veto, and that league was screwed afterwards.. (it was usually the 3 for 1 Pujols trade that did it.. or the trade for slumping A-rod.. they never got vetoed).. i kept playing but it didn't matter

so if a-rod is only hitting 270 with 2 hr's after april, and someone is giving mike mussina and a hot carl everett for him.. i am vetoing that crap immediatly.. but unfortunately, NOBODY ELSE DOES

i don't think it takes talent to make a trade like that. this is my biggest complaint about fantasy baseball, there should be a 5 trade limit or something.. just like there should be a salary cap in real baseball
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Postby trevisc » Tue Feb 03, 2004 10:22 am

j7 wrote:so if a-rod is only hitting 270 with 2 hr's after april, and someone is giving mike mussina and a hot carl everett for him.. i am vetoing that crap immediatly.. but unfortunately, NOBODY ELSE DOES


interesting point because the owner of A-rod last year traded him when he had that neck thing going on and his argument was that he could be an injury risk. We all thought he was crazy but didn't veto it and A-rod had an awesome year.
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Postby Madison » Tue Feb 03, 2004 5:59 pm

Cornbread Maxwell wrote:They lost Pudge, Lee, and Encarnacion. Thats their 3, 4, and 5 hitters.


Surprises me that no one caught this, but the Marlins did not lose their #4 hitter this year. Anyone remember a guy named Lowell?
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Postby Madison » Tue Feb 03, 2004 6:03 pm

j7 wrote:and Erboes, people hate me for this, but your the exact type of manager i like to veto. you probly make perfectly fair trades, but if theres one that makes you a lock for 1st place.. then i have no choice but to VETO .. i wish more managers would do that (makes it more competitive)


That's weak. I truely feel sorry for you if you look at a team and think to yourself that there's no way to beat them.

You "like" to veto fair trades? That's even worse.

Do yourself a favor and play a league where people are not dumb enough to trade away Arod for Mussina/Everett and then your problem with making the league more competitive would be solved.
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Postby j7 » Tue Feb 03, 2004 10:01 pm

maybe your right... i've never actually vetoed a trade i thought was fair.. i don't know why i said "like to", but i was thinking of doing that this year if it involves a pujols/a-rod caliber player. that mussina/everett for a-rod trade was real..and what trevisc saw sounds very similiar.. i've seen a few with pujols last year and i feel very jaded.. just trying to be honest.. sorry if i offended anyone
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