Jeremy Guthrie: Is he this good? - Fantasy Baseball Cafe 2014 Fantasy Baseball Cafe
100% Deposit Bonus for Cafe Members!

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Jeremy Guthrie: Is he this good?

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

Re: Jeremy Guthrie: Is he this good?

Postby tecmobowl12 » Thu Jun 14, 2007 9:17 pm

Guthrie pitched well tonight (6/14) against the Nationals:

7IP, ND, 4H, 1ER, 2BB, 5K, 1.29ERA, .86WHIP

A ground rule double with runners on first and second scored the run. He was pulled after 92 pitches and the Nationals promptly scored the go ahead run off his replacement in the 8th
tecmobowl12
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar
Eagle Eye
Posts: 1323
Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Jeremy Guthrie: Is he this good?

Postby rotoquest » Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:28 am

Interesting article by RotoAuthority:
I don't have Guthrie's starter-only BABIP but overall he's at .242. Say it with me: unsustainable.

Let's take all starters from 2006 with 170+ innings and a K/9 less than 6.0. Of those 28 pitchers, only five were able to allow less than a hit per inning (Clay Hensley was tops at 8.37 H/9). The same exercise for 2005 gives us five starters out of 43. What Guthrie is doing right now isn't even close to sustainable. He won't be under 6 H/9, or under 7 H/9, or under 8 H/9. He's highly unlikely to be under 9 H/9.

The good news is that even if Guthrie had allowed a hit per inning to date, his WHIP would still be 1.14. His control has been amazing. He hasn't flashed this kind of control since Double A in 2003. We have to tip our cap to Leo Mazzone here.

Walking fewer than 2.0 per nine actually is sustainable. We regularly see 10-15 guys do it each year and I don't see why Guthrie can't be one of them. Maybe his control evades him if Mazzone leaves, but as long as it's there Guthrie will be helpful in WHIP.

Guthrie has a 48.4% groundball rate, good for 14th in the league. This development will definitely keep his home run rate nice and low. His 5.7% HR per flyball rate isn't sustainable, but he'll still be strong in HR prevention.

Plugging some reasonable peripherals into the Dierkes-o-matic Component ERA spreadsheet, I like what I see. Let's give him these peripherals:

5.6 K/9
2.0 BB/9
9.2 H/9
0.85 HR/9

The result? A 3.61 ERA and 1.24 WHIP. If this control doesn't escape him and Guthrie keeps throwing grounders, the Orioles have found a stud on the waiver wire. I have to admit I came into this exercise thinking Guthrie was a fluke. But his control and GB% aren't luck and even with major hit rate regression Guthrie could be among the ten best starters in the league.
rotoquest
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar
Cafe Ranker
Posts: 1649
(Past Year: 193)
Joined: 18 Nov 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Jeremy Guthrie: Is he this good?

Postby hot4tx » Tue Jun 19, 2007 10:06 am

I would like to revisit this one real quick:
http://www.fantasybaseballcafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=290892&hilit=guthr%2A
for the guy that called out everyone that was saying he hadn't walked many people and was showing great control. :-°

...mostly because it was the single largest jerk move I've seen on these boards and because after a month he's still been showing very good control and not walking many people.

Again I know pitchers have had it for a few months and lost it, so I'm not saying he's Roy Halladay, but he's looked very good so far and I'll continue riding the hot arm as long as the matchup isn't horrible.
hot4tx
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar

Posts: 1933
(Past Year: 135)
Joined: 16 Feb 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Jeremy Guthrie: Is he this good?

Postby tecmobowl12 » Thu Jun 21, 2007 5:23 pm

6/20 at San Diego - Guthrie actually got run support last night, though he didn't need much:

8IP, W, 4H, 1ER, 1BB, 9K, 1.13ERA, .63WHIP

Gave up a home run in the 7th. Seemed to always be ahead in the count. He has put together quite a string of starts since moving into the rotation. A gem of a fantasy team's sixth starter IMO
Image
tecmobowl12
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar
Eagle Eye
Posts: 1323
Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: Jeremy Guthrie: Is he this good?

Postby godallahstar » Fri Jun 22, 2007 4:24 am

hot4tx wrote:I would like to revisit this one real quick:
http://www.fantasybaseballcafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=290892&hilit=guthr%2A
for the guy that called out everyone that was saying he hadn't walked many people and was showing great control. :-°

...mostly because it was the single largest jerk move I've seen on these boards and because after a month he's still been showing very good control and not walking many people.

Again I know pitchers have had it for a few months and lost it, so I'm not saying he's Roy Halladay, but he's looked very good so far and I'll continue riding the hot arm as long as the matchup isn't horrible.


.. yes, back then you claimed he had great control without researching his past,
where it was clear it was his main issue.
you didn't claim he fixed it, you claimed he had great control which you based off of that small sample size,
which was wrong and misleading.
you offered absolutely no insight other than vague speculative opinion.

advice like "ride the streak" or you grading him as "Guarded Optimism" is relatively meaningless when you have no ground to stand on,
you said he didn't have huge upside .. yet he can throw high 90's with crazy movement. not exactly a junkballer, eh.
if you don't know what you're talking about, then don't give advice to other people on that matter.
i don't care if i come off as harsh or abrasive,
it's annoying reading some of the nonsense people post on these boards.
at least i gave out information on the guy;

he gets a good amount of groundballs, nothing amazing.
the finish of his delivery is a bit weird, seems like he gets his shoulder out there and his fastball has some nasty movement to the right, it sits in the low to mid 90's but he can put a little extra on it when he needs to, the highest i remember him working is 97/98.
his mid 80's breaking ball is real good and when he hits his spots i really don't see why he can't be a good strikeout pitcher, certainly not 9k/9ip but 6 sounds reasonable.

this is all really dependent on whether or not he's throwing strikes and avoiding piling up the walks, because no, he does not have great command, but maybe working with mazzone he's fixing this.
godallahstar
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 588
Joined: 9 May 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: minneapolis

Previous

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: scarnicease and 6 guests

Forums Articles & Tips Sleepers Rankings Leagues


Today's Games
Saturday, Sep. 20
(All times are EST, weather icons show forecast for game time)

LA Dodgers at Chi Cubs
(1:05 pm)
Detroit at Kansas City
(1:05 pm)
Toronto at NY Yankees
(4:05 pm)
Philadelphia at Oakland
(4:05 pm)
Arizona at Colorado
(4:10 pm)
Boston at Baltimore
(7:05 pm)
Milwaukee at Pittsburgh
(7:05 pm)
Chi White Sox at Tampa Bay
(7:10 pm)
indoors
Cleveland at Minnesota
(7:10 pm)
Washington at Miami
(7:10 pm)
indoors
Seattle at Houston
(7:10 pm)
NY Mets at Atlanta
(7:10 pm)
Cincinnati at St. Louis
(7:15 pm)
San Francisco at San Diego
(8:40 pm)
Texas at LA Angels
(9:05 pm)

  • Fantasy Baseball
  • Article Submissions
  • Privacy Statement
  • Site Survey 
  • Contact