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Postby bigh0rt » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:08 pm

RocketsDWM wrote:Great idea for a thread by the way. ;-D ;-D


Completely agree.

I disagree. From player management side it gives the NL a large advantage.

The AL needs to allocate money to field start 9 everyday players. The NL only needs to field 8 starting everyday players. So NL teams can spend more money on each individual player. This enables an NL Team X, which has the same budget as an AL Team Y, to outbid Team Y, and thereby get the best free agents.


The fundamental flaw with this argument is the assumption that all teams are operating with the same budget. If that were the case, you could argue that AL teams had to allocate less money per player, to field a full team of 9 batters. I could see this being an issue with smaller market AL teams, but for the larger market teams, all its doing is creating more lineup flexibility, and allowing their starting pitchers to go deeper into games without having to be strategically pulled in a double switch. I do think, however, as previously stated, that removal of the DH from the AL would lead to many AL payrolls taking a ride south.
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Postby RocketsDWM » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:08 pm

davidmarver wrote:
RocketsDWM wrote:Who would you rather see bat: Ortiz or Ben Sheets?

Seems like an obvious answer to me. Thats what I mean by the best possible lineup.

Who would you rather see pitch: Sheets or Ortiz? With that 9th slot, you have to choose one or the other: Ortiz pitch and hit, or Sheets pitch and hit. Pretty obvious to me which one of those is the 'best possible lineup'.

I dont want to see the star pitcher go down with an injury because he was swinging a bat.

Because that's such a frequent occurance. The list of NL pitchers that have gone on the DL the past ten years due to injuries acquired while hitting is about as short as those in MLB who can outeat Red Sox 'player' David Ortiz.


Why not have the best of both worlds and have Sheets pitch and Ortiz DH.

By the way, Ortiz is not that bad of a first basemen. It happens that Youk is just better defensively. Ortiz played great D in the World Series of '04 and has been decent in interleague play over the yrs (while he was with the Sox). He isnt a Tex but he can hold his own.
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Postby hersch223 » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:09 pm

jealousblues wrote:
RocketsDWM wrote:I dont want to see pitchers bat and have the potential with injury by having them bat. Why not have the best lineup out there?


Good point, maybe we can Have Pujols hit all nine spots...
best line up and all ;-)


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Postby sportsaddict » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:10 pm

thedude wrote:
sportsaddict wrote:I agree, people always make the statement that AL ball is more exciting but I see it as an issue of fairness as opposed to entertainment. It's a huge advantage for the AL to have the DH, so even if it's more entertaining, it's cheap to the NL because they don't have it.



I disagree. From player management side it gives the NL a large advantage.

The AL needs to allocate money to field start 9 everyday players. The NL only needs to field 8 starting everyday players. So NL teams can spend more money on each individual player. This enables an NL Team X, which has the same budget as an AL Team Y, to outbid Team Y, and thereby get the best free agents.


Your argument makes sense but by having an extra hitter in their lineup, the entire lineup is strengthened- lets take the White Sox as an example. If they could only have Thome or Konerko, their entire lineup would be thrown off- it would become that much weaker without one of them. That's why the DH gives the AL the advantage, it allows for their lineups to be much stronger.
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Postby sportsaddict » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:11 pm

hersch223 wrote:
jealousblues wrote:
RocketsDWM wrote:I dont want to see pitchers bat and have the potential with injury by having them bat. Why not have the best lineup out there?


Good point, maybe we can Have Pujols hit all nine spots...
best line up and all ;-)


Ghost runner on first!!!!


Haha, good old wiffleball/pickup baseball games. ;-D
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Postby Snakes Gould » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:13 pm

sportsaddict wrote:
thedude wrote:
sportsaddict wrote:I agree, people always make the statement that AL ball is more exciting but I see it as an issue of fairness as opposed to entertainment. It's a huge advantage for the AL to have the DH, so even if it's more entertaining, it's cheap to the NL because they don't have it.



I disagree. From player management side it gives the NL a large advantage.

The AL needs to allocate money to field start 9 everyday players. The NL only needs to field 8 starting everyday players. So NL teams can spend more money on each individual player. This enables an NL Team X, which has the same budget as an AL Team Y, to outbid Team Y, and thereby get the best free agents.


Your argument makes sense but by having an extra hitter in their lineup, the entire lineup is strengthened- lets take the White Sox as an example. If they could only have Thome or Konerko, their entire lineup would be thrown off- it would become that much weaker without one of them. That's why the DH gives the AL the advantage, it allows for their lineups to be much stronger.


yeah but its not like they would even have both on their teams right now. they could easily trade thome to a team like the yankees for another position
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Postby samjerky » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:15 pm

sportsaddict wrote: That's why the DH gives the AL the advantage, it allows for their lineups to be much stronger.


But Thome doesn't come with a DH stamp on his forehead. If the guy had to play an OF position but the Sox could then drop another player and use it toward a pitcher upgrade, wouldn't that mean they had a stronger team?
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Postby jealousblues » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:15 pm

sportsaddict wrote:Oh yeah also, since bighort was talking about AL managers not having to manage the game as much, it got me to thinking that managers in the AL do not have to deal with pinch hitting for their pitchers like NL managers do. So when the 6th inning rolls around, and the pitcher's spot comes up in a 2-1 game with 2 on and 2 outs, the NL manager has to make the tough decision as to pinch hit or not, but the AL does not deal with this.


and relievers too.
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Postby sportsaddict » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:17 pm

Snakes Gould wrote:
sportsaddict wrote:
thedude wrote:
sportsaddict wrote:I agree, people always make the statement that AL ball is more exciting but I see it as an issue of fairness as opposed to entertainment. It's a huge advantage for the AL to have the DH, so even if it's more entertaining, it's cheap to the NL because they don't have it.



I disagree. From player management side it gives the NL a large advantage.

The AL needs to allocate money to field start 9 everyday players. The NL only needs to field 8 starting everyday players. So NL teams can spend more money on each individual player. This enables an NL Team X, which has the same budget as an AL Team Y, to outbid Team Y, and thereby get the best free agents.


Your argument makes sense but by having an extra hitter in their lineup, the entire lineup is strengthened- lets take the White Sox as an example. If they could only have Thome or Konerko, their entire lineup would be thrown off- it would become that much weaker without one of them. That's why the DH gives the AL the advantage, it allows for their lineups to be much stronger.


yeah but its not like they would even have both on their teams right now. they could easily trade thome to a team like the yankees for another position


Even if it's not a player of the caliber of Thome, having an actual hitter hitting for the pitcher makes your lineup that much better.
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