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Koufax's 1965 Season..Best ever in history by a pitcher?

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Postby itodd » Thu Apr 12, 2007 9:24 am

that guy who played for the Providence Greys in like 1889 or something, dude had nearly 50 wins and like 40 CGs and 300+ Ks...
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Postby 05worldserieschamps » Thu Apr 12, 2007 10:30 am

Pedro in his prime is the Best pitcher ever. Period. In my mind, Johan doesn't even come close.
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Postby UncleIvan » Thu Apr 12, 2007 11:28 am

05worldserieschamps wrote:In my mind, Johan doesn't even come close.


I don't think that's even arguable
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Postby tal1286 » Thu Apr 12, 2007 11:45 am

UncleIvan wrote:
05worldserieschamps wrote:In my mind, Johan doesn't even come close.


I don't think that's even arguable


In which direction?
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Postby pepperoncino » Thu Apr 12, 2007 12:04 pm

no doubt, for three or four years there, pedro was the best ever. when you put it in the context of the era he played in, it's just absolutely sick.
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Postby Melo255 » Thu Apr 12, 2007 2:05 pm

pepperoncino wrote:no doubt, for three or four years there, pedro was the best ever. when you put it in the context of the era he played in, it's just absolutely sick.


100% correct. When you consider the era Pedro was pitching in and his stats vs other starters it's not even close. Pedro had the best couple of seasons I've ever seen.

It's funny too because Pedro could very well have won 27 games in '99 and '00. I remember the Sox would score runs for every pitcher but whenever Pedro would start they would become totally unable to hit. The Sox never seemed to hit for Pedro during his whole career. It must have cost him 30-40 wins overall.

Also have to mention that in 2002 if you take out his first start of the year where he gave up 7 runs in 3 innings he had a 1.97 era over every one of his other starts. As it is he had a 2.26 era for the season but really he was even more dominant than that.
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let us not forget maddux

Postby PacmanJr » Thu Apr 12, 2007 3:05 pm

Maddux doesn't have an elite fastball, yet he wrecked shop.

1995 19-2 in only 28 games - 10 complete games - 209.67 IP - 1.63 ERA - .811 WHIP - 181K
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Postby SignGuy » Thu Apr 12, 2007 4:17 pm

Clemens has some ridiculous seasons also, but im on the pedro wagon as well. '99 was his best IMO
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Postby jake_twothousandfive » Thu Apr 12, 2007 4:28 pm

I'll jump on that Pedro bandwagon. The guy was just plain sick for a number of years, despite all the juicers.
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Postby thedude » Thu Apr 12, 2007 4:33 pm

itodd wrote:that guy who played for the Providence Greys in like 1889 or something, dude had nearly 50 wins and like 40 CGs and 300+ Ks...


Old Hoss Radburn was his name.


You can't use complete games, wins, or K's to compare pitchers across eras. It just isn't fair. When Radbourn was pitching he was on a two man rotation.

When Koufax and Gibson were pitching the mound had yet to be lowered. The best tool is ERA+ because it compares pitchers era to league average pitchers and even that is not great because the overall talent level has imporved over the years.


Here are the top 10 single season ERA+ of all-time:



Code: Select all
# Name (age) ERA+ Year
1. Tim Keefe+ (23) 294 1880
2. Pedro Martinez (28) 285 2000
3. Dutch Leonard* (22) 279 1914
4. Greg Maddux (28) 273 1994
5. Walter Johnson+ (25) 259 1913
t5. Greg Maddux (29) 259 1995
7. Bob Gibson+ (32) 258 1968
8. Mordecai Brown+ (29) 253 1906
9. Pedro Martinez (27) 245 1999
10. Walter Johnson+ (24) 240 1912


Time Keefe pitched before the mound was moved from 50 feet to 60 feet 6 inches.
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