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Pettite is an Astro

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Postby Madison » Wed Dec 10, 2003 8:07 pm

Transmogrifier wrote:It's basically a rehash of the Houston Chronicle article I put up. Do you doubt this Mad and WR?


It's not that I doubt it, I just prefer to see it in writing. ;-)
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Postby wrveres » Wed Dec 10, 2003 8:10 pm

Madison wrote:
Transmogrifier wrote:It's basically a rehash of the Houston Chronicle article I put up. Do you doubt this Mad and WR?


It's not that I doubt it, I just prefer to see it in writing. ;-)


no doubt's ... i was just asking if it was final .... The Title seems to lead one to believe it is ... no biggie ... ;-D
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Postby pkarr5000 » Wed Dec 10, 2003 8:19 pm

yay. houstons still gonna lose to chicago so theres really no point :-/
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Postby Gang Green » Wed Dec 10, 2003 8:44 pm

I hope George is on his private jet from Tampa to Houston. He got that bum Clemens his World Series ring, so he should have Clemens meet him at the airport when they go to Andy's house. Kiss Andy's fanny. Give him whatever he wants. Let him bring his hunting rifle to Opening Day and shoot George's stupid beloved "Challenger" bird.
On a different note, overrated? Andy? You forget. Andy is one of the top lefties in the game. Remember the left handed part. Without Pettitte, who is the lefthanded starter in their starting five? He is a very valuable commodity. I believe he is the first pitcher in history to win at least 14 games in either his first 6 or 7 seasons. He also is tied with Smoltz for most career postseason victories. You want to keep saying he is a byproduct of pitching for the Yankees, fine. But he's won alot of big games for us. You know, Kenny Roger was a lefty with alot of talent who pitched for the Yankees. How did he work out? Andy better not leave.
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Postby Transmogrifier » Wed Dec 10, 2003 9:21 pm

Gang Green wrote:On a different note, overrated? Andy? You forget. Andy is one of the top lefties in the game. Remember the left handed part. Without Pettitte, who is the lefthanded starter in their starting five? He is a very valuable commodity. I believe he is the first pitcher in history to win at least 14 games in either his first 6 or 7 seasons. He also is tied with Smoltz for most career postseason victories. You want to keep saying he is a byproduct of pitching for the Yankees, fine. But he's won alot of big games for us.


Andy is a good pitcher that has been reliable and suceedes in NY--not an easy thing to do. The Yankees will really miss him.

But his win total is largely a product of playing for the Yankees as his ERA isn't that good. That's why I say he's overrated.

The Yanks will miss him. (I won't, but that's another matter.) :-D
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Postby Gang Green » Wed Dec 10, 2003 9:40 pm

The one deathknell sign that I am ignoring today is that Andy's father has now been quoted as saying that Andy has been disrespected by Steinbrenner. When dad gets involved, its a bad sign. Remember Messier and his pops in their ugly departure from the NY Rangers. Well Georgie, if you had your way from the beginning, Bernie and Andy would have been long gone by now. It's a true story that Stick Michael used to lie to George that nobody was interested in Bernie when George wanted to trade him early in his career. If Andy leaves, I think I'm gonna act like the Cubans in south Florida towards Castro. I am going to become a Yankee defector and I'm not coming back into the fold until that meglomaniacal meathead kicks the bucket. Because that is the only way he's giving up the reigns to the "empire."
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Postby Lofunzo » Wed Dec 10, 2003 9:57 pm

Gang Green wrote:The one deathknell sign that I am ignoring today is that Andy's father has now been quoted as saying that Andy has been disrespected by Steinbrenner. When dad gets involved, its a bad sign. Remember Messier and his pops in their ugly departure from the NY Rangers. Well Georgie, if you had your way from the beginning, Bernie and Andy would have been long gone by now. It's a true story that Stick Michael used to lie to George that nobody was interested in Bernie when George wanted to trade him early in his career. If Andy leaves, I think I'm gonna act like the Cubans in south Florida towards Castro. I am going to become a Yankee defector and I'm not coming back into the fold until that meglomaniacal meathead kicks the bucket. Because that is the only way he's giving up the reigns to the "empire."


That's true but remember that Messier's father is also his agent. Mixing family with business usually ends in disaster, especially when they are on the payroll.


Free agent lefthander Andy Pettitte, one of baseball's winningest pitchers, is on the verge of an agreement with the Astros, industry sources said this afternoon.

The sources cautioned that some details remained to be worked out and that the deal still could fall apart if the New York Yankees made a last-ditch effort to re-sign Pettitte.

Pettitte has already passed a physical, and Astros owner Drayton McLane and agents Randy and Alan Hendricks are attempting to complete the deal within 24 hours.

Barring a snag, Pettitte would give the Astros a bona fide No. 1 starting pitcher they haven't had in several years.

His departure would be a blow for the Yankees, who had said re-signing him was their No. 1 off season priority.



Here's my (more than) 2 cents on some things:

1. Steinbrenner has played with fire with this stuff. On 1 hand, I understand why. Say what you want about the crazy salaries in MLB. The Yanks never set the trend. They only follow it. On the other hand, you potentially alienate your players. That is what has happened here. Pettitte has been waiting for George to make him a good offer and he has been dragging his feet. For some reason, he has always never been too fond of him. You would think that Schilling signing and #2 below would make him make a move.
2. Tom Verducci, who I respect for his knowledge, stated today that he expects A-Rod to go to the Sox early next week. In turn, Nomar would go west, possibly to the Angels for Kennedy and Washburn. While Washburn might do well, that would leave them with 6 starters. Would they trade Kim and give him the finger? If anyone thinks that Epsteain is involved in this deal, they are crazy. This is way above his head. About all that he will do for this deal is pick A-Rod up at the airport when he comes to Boston.
3. Maddux will probably either sign with the Cards or the Padres.
4. The Yanks will not get Brown. Part of that deal (Johnson) went to Montreal for Vaz.
5. The Yanks will not get Millwood as the Phillies (surprisingly) offered him arbitration. So much for that 5 year, $75 million contract on the table, huh Scott?

For all the offense that the Yanks might get with Sheff or whoever else, their main need was to sign pitching, including Pettitte. If they fail to sign him, and it's not a done deal yet, then they had a bad offseason.
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Postby Siege1386 » Wed Dec 10, 2003 10:18 pm

The key here is that the deal is not done, like said by Pettite's agent. The Yankees can still counter the offer. Also Pettite is getting $10 mil reportedly from the Astros. That deal sucks according to his standards. He is trying to milk $14 mil. out of the Yanks. He could also take arbitration and play for the Yanks for one more year and get $14-15 mil, but then only half is guarenteed if he gets hurt during spring training.

I don't think this is over yet.
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Postby joshheines » Wed Dec 10, 2003 10:34 pm

Why is Pettite overrated? Simple. Let's look at his career numbers.

3.94 ERA, 1.38 WHIP, 2.2K:B Ratio, 6.4 K/9

Since 1998, he's had one, just ONE year, where his ERA was under 3.99. And that year was 2002, when he didn't even pitch a full year.

He's had one year in his career that would justify paying him $14 million per year, and that was way back in '97.

I hate the Yankees, and I know it would kill them (emotionally) to lose Pettite. So whether the Yankees lose Pettite or they use their powers as the evil empire and pay him an unjustified $14 million per year, I am happy!
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Postby timkell » Wed Dec 10, 2003 10:44 pm

I would agree that Pettite is a tad overrated. We've had this talk before. Overrated does not mean bad. It just means "viewed as better than he is."

Pettite's a damn good pitcher. If the Yanks lose him, it's terrible. But is he a staff ace? No. Is he worth $15 million per year? No. I don't think so.

Schilling's making only about $13 million a year, right? Pettite is no Schilling.

If it takes 15 mill for the Yankees to get him, then I think it would be a wise decision to let him go.
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