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Ok Foulke, cough it up already.

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Postby MashinSpuds » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:07 pm

You would think the simple logic here is that since the A's already have a top notch rotation and a very good bullpen, why keep what amounts to frosting when you need some offensive cake? Get some cheap closer and/or convert a reliever and get a decent bat or two to fill some voids. As much as they'd like to keep Foulke I would have to agree that the smart decision would be to get some bats instead of hanging onto Foulke.
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Postby ramble2 » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:16 pm

Percival: $7.5 million
Wagner: $8.0 million
Rivera: $7.45 million
Isringhausen: $27 million over '02-'05
Benitez: $6.75 million in '03 (now a FA)
Hoffman: $9.0 million in '03, $10 million in '04 (or $2 million buyout & renegotiate)
Sasaki: $8.0 million

How does Foulke rate against these closers? How does Foulke rate among FA closers available this off season? Among all FA pitchers this season?

Colon will get $48 million over 4 years from the Angels.
Escobar will get $18 million over 3 years from the Angels.

If the A's can sign him at $5 million a year for four years, that's a good deal. He's an excellent pitcher. Even Beane, with an aversion to paying premium money for closers, recognizes a good deal when he sees one. That is way below recent market values for a premier closer. He would make excellent trade bait should the market ever heat back up.

If I were Foulke, I'd be looking for a bigger contract too. I would even consider risking a one-year contract back with the A's and hope that next year's FA market will produce bigger contracts. This year's numbers are pretty flat.
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Postby ramble2 » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:21 pm

What about Oakland's bats? Believe me, I would love to see Beane sign some quality bats to help out Chavez. Nothing fancy or super expensive, but someone who would help.

I don't think it's going to happen. Beane will bring up some of the youngsters and see how they do. After a couple of months you'll see the A's make a trade or two to shore up whatever positions they are weakest at. There are so many offensive holes (gulp!) to fill, that the A's will probably have to settle for putting out fires via trades next season. A's fan, have faith that Beane will get the trades done, and have hope that some of the young call ups and off-season acquisitions will perform well. Admittedly, it's not the easiest or most secure way to compete, but it's worked in the past.
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Postby Transmogrifier » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:28 pm

True, under this market Foulke may be underpaid, but I think it shows how absurd closer--one inning pitchers--salaries have gone. I'm not sure it's fair. Hey, under this logic, Nomar should get Jeter money, Vlad should get better than Manny money, etc.

And it's not five million per year. What I've seen is 3 years, 20 million or so. That's pretty damn good.

Now, if Beane has five million to spend, then why not get a much better bat? It makes no sense.
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Postby Jivedude » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:31 pm

Transmogrifier wrote:True, under this market Foulke may be underpaid, but I think it shows how absurd closer--one inning pitchers--salaries have gone. I'm not sure it's fair. Hey, under this logic, Nomar should get Jeter money, Vlad should get better than Manny money, etc.

And it's not five million per year. What I've seen is 3 years, 20 million or so. That's pretty damn good.

Now, if Beane has five million to spend, then why not get a much better bat? It makes no sense.


Actually I thought the Red Sox were offering him $21 million over 3 years. That's $7 million per year, which certainly is right up there with what the other elite closers are getting.
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Postby Transmogrifier » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:35 pm

Oakland has made the closer a four-year offer believed to be worth more than $20 million but not as much as the $24 million that has been previously reported. Boston reportedly has presented Foulke with a three-year deal with a vested option for a fourth year that could total $26 million.


Unlikely that the fourth year is only five million. It could be three years at 18 million and eight extra for the fourth year or something like that.
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Postby ramble2 » Tue Dec 09, 2003 7:57 pm

Jivedude wrote:
Transmogrifier wrote:True, under this market Foulke may be underpaid, but I think it shows how absurd closer--one inning pitchers--salaries have gone. I'm not sure it's fair. Hey, under this logic, Nomar should get Jeter money, Vlad should get better than Manny money, etc.

And it's not five million per year. What I've seen is 3 years, 20 million or so. That's pretty damn good.

Now, if Beane has five million to spend, then why not get a much better bat? It makes no sense.


Actually I thought the Red Sox were offering him $21 million over 3 years. That's $7 million per year, which certainly is right up there with what the other elite closers are getting.


Ah, I didn't realize that was the 3-year deal on the table. That's more in line with what I'd expect a top closer to get in this market - down a little from past years, but not the $5 million the A's are offering.

Who knows what gives. Foulke probably really likes pitching for the A's - and that park - and wants to stay. He might have gotten a little spooked by Fenway after Ortiz beat him. :~(
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Postby Jivedude » Tue Dec 09, 2003 8:02 pm

Yeah it was my understanding that the Red Sox were offering $21 million over 3 years with an option while Oakland was offering $24 million over 4 years. Foulke would prefer a 4 year deal.
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Postby Madison » Tue Dec 09, 2003 9:47 pm

I still think Foulke is trying to use his signing as leverage to get the A's to get off their duffs and sign a bat right now. I'm pretty sure that if the A's signed a good bat or two, Foulke would stay. They might want to hurry up and do it though..............
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Postby MashinSpuds » Wed Dec 10, 2003 11:16 am

I haven't heard any rumors yet regarding bats that the A's are pursuing. Maybe they're waiting for the market to quiet down a little and observe the aftermath of who didn't get signed via arbitration. If this is the case then it may take a long time before Foulke gets signed everywhere if he's truly watching the A's hiring process.

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