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Is Arod worth it?

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Postby LBJackal » Tue Dec 09, 2003 2:11 am

Delgado was gypt in 2000, and again in 2003. That's all I'm gonna say...
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Postby Madison » Tue Dec 09, 2003 2:29 am

LBJackal wrote:Delgado was gypt in 2000, and again in 2003. That's all I'm gonna say...


Lol. :-b No problem. ;-D

Arod was robbed in '02. :-D
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Postby HOOTIE » Tue Dec 09, 2003 3:26 am

LBJackal wrote:A-Rod shouldn't have won MVP....he wasn't valuable to the Rangers in baseball terms. They were last with him, they woulda been last without him. It's not a stats contest, it's how valuable they are to their team.....however I'm sure this has already been discussed.


If you look at things like win shares,( value to team), you can get a idea. Arod lead al in win shares. Delgado to his credit was 2nd, and finished 2nd as he should of. You can also look at VORP (value above replacement player, for value. Texas would have won far fewer games, roughly 11, had Arod not been there.
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Postby Lofunzo » Tue Dec 09, 2003 3:55 am

LBJackal wrote:A-Rod shouldn't have won MVP....he wasn't valuable to the Rangers in baseball terms. They were last with him, they woulda been last without him. It's not a stats contest, it's how valuable they are to their team.....however I'm sure this has already been discussed.


Don't get me started again on this but there is a chance that without him, they would have lost 30 more games. That shouldn't be held against him. If someone is less responsible for wins but happens to be on a winning team, why should they get more consideration. I believe that, all things equal, the winner should come from a winning team but all things weren't equal.

P.S. The 30 games statement above is purely hypothetical. Please remember that before quoting numbers, Hootie. :-D
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Postby Transmogrifier » Tue Dec 09, 2003 10:31 am

Erboes wrote:If Nomar ever could take a pitch he'd probably stay in Boston, but he's getting less and less selective while the team moves in the other direction. Boston may have noticed a correlation between his selectivity and his average, which has been in steady decline. It will be interesting to see how much Nomar's average falls in a different park if he is traded. The guy could be a .280, 35 homer player, which is my guess.


There's a stat, and I'm not sure where it is, and this is just from memory, that Nomar is a very good hitter when he swings at the first pitch. At one point he was a .350 hitter or better on the first pitch. But then again, at one time he was simply a .350 or better hitter. Alas, his wrist has affected his timing. It's not the same Nomar. :-[
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Postby The Cow » Tue Dec 09, 2003 10:51 am

I see Boston getting AROD, then signing VLAD to replace Manny and then dealing Nomar for well I have no idea. Now are the Sox better with Manny/Nomar or with VLAD/AROD???? I would take VLAD/AROD easily.

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Postby Pogotheostrich » Tue Dec 09, 2003 11:12 am

No way Vlad is going to Boston. Here is a couple of reasons.

1. If the Manny for Arod thing goes off Boston will have an even higher payroll. Vlad is going to be around $15 mil a year.

2. Vlad doesn't like being in the spotlight.

3. It has been mentioned before that the Red Sox are trying to be more selective at the plate. Vlad is anything but selective.

Vlad to Boston. Just isn't going to happen.
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Postby Erboes » Tue Dec 09, 2003 11:36 am

Wow, there, Pogo. Although I agree Guerrero is probably not going to Boston, it's not because Guerrero isn't selective. He walked 84 times in '02 and was on pace for more than that last season if he wasn't hurt. His walks have been increasing yearly and I wouldn't be surprised if he breaks 100 this season.

I know you can fall into sloppiness while arguing Cow's silly statements, but it is always best to have the facts straight no matter what the debate.
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Postby Madison » Tue Dec 09, 2003 11:37 am

Transmogrifier wrote:
Erboes wrote:If Nomar ever could take a pitch he'd probably stay in Boston, but he's getting less and less selective while the team moves in the other direction. Boston may have noticed a correlation between his selectivity and his average, which has been in steady decline. It will be interesting to see how much Nomar's average falls in a different park if he is traded. The guy could be a .280, 35 homer player, which is my guess.


There's a stat, and I'm not sure where it is, and this is just from memory, that Nomar is a very good hitter when he swings at the first pitch. At one point he was a .350 hitter or better on the first pitch. But then again, at one time he was simply a .350 or better hitter. Alas, his wrist has affected his timing. It's not the same Nomar. :-[


Pudge is/was that way as well. He really liked to swing at the first pitch. Couldn't complain when he was hitting .300 every year. Not sure if or how much that changed last year with the Marlins, but when he was with Texas, first pitch swing most of the time.
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Postby Pogotheostrich » Tue Dec 09, 2003 11:56 am

Erboes wrote:Wow, there, Pogo. Although I agree Guerrero is probably not going to Boston, it's not because Guerrero isn't selective. He walked 84 times in '02 and was on pace for more than that last season if he wasn't hurt. His walks have been increasing yearly and I wouldn't be surprised if he breaks 100 this season.

I know you can fall into sloppiness while arguing Cow's silly statements, but it is always best to have the facts straight no matter what the debate.


Yes his walks have gone up. But in 2002 he was still ranked #141 in pitches per plate appearance.
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