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Bruce

Postby Maow » Thu Jan 04, 2007 4:40 pm

Koby,
Where did you hear that Bruce was going to 1B? I have always heard what a great OF he was with a great arm. I know he had some shoulder problems last year(no idea what arm) surely they aren't ready to bail on him over that. Some were even saying he could probably play CF in the majors for his first few years. I am way off here?
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Re: Bruce

Postby KDOGG » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:21 pm

Maow wrote:Koby,
Where did you hear that Bruce was going to 1B? I have always heard what a great OF he was with a great arm. I know he had some shoulder problems last year(no idea what arm) surely they aren't ready to bail on him over that. Some were even saying he could probably play CF in the majors for his first few years. I am way off here?


I think he was probably thinking about Joey Votto.
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Re: Bruce

Postby Koby Schellenger » Fri Jan 05, 2007 7:25 pm

KDOGG wrote:
Maow wrote:Koby,
Where did you hear that Bruce was going to 1B? I have always heard what a great OF he was with a great arm. I know he had some shoulder problems last year(no idea what arm) surely they aren't ready to bail on him over that. Some were even saying he could probably play CF in the majors for his first few years. I am way off here?


I think he was probably thinking about Joey Votto.


Yeah, i was trying to do too many things at once.

sockeye, the BP articles are likely on archive there. I have not renewed my subscription yet this year but if you have a subscription you can dig it up.
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Re: Bruce

Postby sockeye » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:04 pm

Koby Schellenger wrote:
KDOGG wrote:
Maow wrote:Koby,
Where did you hear that Bruce was going to 1B? I have always heard what a great OF he was with a great arm. I know he had some shoulder problems last year(no idea what arm) surely they aren't ready to bail on him over that. Some were even saying he could probably play CF in the majors for his first few years. I am way off here?


I think he was probably thinking about Joey Votto.


Yeah, i was trying to do too many things at once.

sockeye, the BP articles are likely on archive there. I have not renewed my subscription yet this year but if you have a subscription you can dig it up.


Koby, I was puzzled at the reference to a BP study of pitcher size and durability because I was 95% sure I remember Will Caroll saying a chat session that he knew of no study of height and injury risk. Maybe it was Jim Callis instead, but I don't think so.

I took your advice and searched the BP archives for "pitcher durability" and "pitcher height", and came up with nothing that discusses height vs injury rosk. Many articles on abuse and durability, but none with height. Interesting, I did come across an article by David Cameron in 2003 in which he appluads the Astros for mining a "untapped" talent vein for short, right-handed pitchers.

Are you 100% that you have seen such articles (even if not at BP)? I recall a diary on the Sickels blog from earlier this fall in which people were classifiying IPs by pitchers under and over 6', and am wondering if you have this confused with the study you cite on Page 1 (or maybe 2) of this thread.

Please let us know....it's a topic that comes up repeatedly, and is pretty relevaant this year with Lincecum, Lincoln, and Morales.
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Postby Galt » Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:51 pm

There is a study. And the BFA is that it's not the fact that Lincecum is only 5'10" that's the big worry, it's the fact that he has an emaciated 160 pound frame that is the worry.

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/artic ... er-part-5/

And the fact that Lincecum is 160 pounds is a very bad sign for his long-term durability. Pick out the Pedro's, Kazmir's, and Oswalt's all you want, but you self-selecting anomolies doesn't make the worry about his size any less valid.
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Postby EvSolo » Sun Jan 07, 2007 2:31 pm

i dont think glavine is a good comparison because he himself has said that he has basically never thrown 100% on any pitch. this is the total opposite of linecum.
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Postby CeeLoGreen » Fri Jan 19, 2007 2:10 pm

Linecum actually went first overall in a dynasty league prospect draft I am in. Might be because the guy needs pitching help, but I grabbed Maybin with the second pick. He is more of a long-term project, but I think he has the skill set to be special. Think Grady Sizemore...
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Postby nathan050904 » Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:08 pm

Kevin Goldstein (Baseball Prospectus formally of Baseball America) Best pure stuff of any 2006 draftee. Despite looking like a 13-year-old on the mound, Lincecum's unorthodox mechanics and the fastest arm action you'll ever see allow him to unleash 92-96 mph fastballs while touching 98-99 and maintaining that velocity throughout the game. Curveball is an even better offering, grading out by many scouts as a pure 80 on the 20-80 scouting scale. Slider and changeup are there and usable. Despite size and delivery, arm was remarkably resilient in college, as he often closed 1-2 days after racking up a high pitch count without ever having problems with arm soreness.


I thought you said he looses velocity were you watching the same player?

Kevin Goldstein (BP)Lincecum is quickly becoming one of the hardest players to rank in all of minor league baseball. While it's only 26.2 innings, the raw statistics are ridiculous, and the stuff is as well; Lincecum has already touched 100 mph as a pro, and his curveball is among the best in the minors. The only issues here are some control problems in his past and his size--but at what point do we stop caring about the fact that the guy is 5-foot-10 and 160 pounds? He showed a rubber arm in college, never having injury problems despite some ridiculous pitch counts on Fridays and frequent relief appearances on Sundays. He's an aberration, and he's seemingly proven that what is normally a concern shouldn't be in this individual case. Yet, I put him fifth here--on stuff alone, he might deserve a ranking as high as No. 1.


Jim Callis (Baseball America)
I love Tim Lincecum's future. We just did our individual Top 50 Prospects lists for the Handbook (which is done by the way, thank God), and I ranked Lincecum No. 10.


Jim Callis (Baseball America)
Jerry (Portland, OR): Hey Jim, thanks for the chat. What do the Giants do with Lincecum this season?

SportsNation Jim Callis: I bet he forces his way into their rotation very quickly.


So Kolby what you got to say now? I bet your one of those guys who said the same thing bout Pedro, Oswalt, Kazmir just to name a few. I am sorry but, the comments you got are old a lot of them come from around draft time but, when I see Callis and Goldstein making such projections I tend to believe them over some of the other sources you pointed out.







So yea Kolby what are you talking about?[/quote]
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Postby Koby Schellenger » Sat Jan 20, 2007 3:41 am

First, It'd be great if you understood English.

nathan050904 wrote:I thought you said he looses velocity were you watching the same player?


Perhaps you meant LOSES???????


I stand by my analysis. If you want to beieve Kevin Goldstein...fine...I don't care. But here are some cold hard facts:

Lincecum threw in 7 relief appearances verus 58 as a starter in college. If you call that often, you clearly don't understand the word often.

I will stand by MY analysis from seeing him pitch in college and the professional ranks. I report what I have reorded through my own notes and recordings, not anyone elses.

If you want to regurgitate what you've read from other people who have seen him, that's fine. I don't really care. What I have to say about Lincecum is the same thing I've had to say about him for a long time:

He is a good prosepct who is more suitable for the bullpen as a result of:
a) his stature
b) his mechanics
c) his stuff
d) his workload
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Postby audioboy » Sat Jan 20, 2007 4:28 pm

Made another deal and now I have 5 of the top 10. Numbers 1,2,5,8 and 10

hoping for something like:

1. Maybin
2. Bruce
5. Gallardo
8. Lincecum
10. Kershaw

Obviously I get any of the top 2, hopefully no one snatches the others before I can get around to them
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