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Loose Change?

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Postby Coppermine » Sat Dec 02, 2006 10:37 pm

pokeyjoe wrote:
The Miner Part 2 wrote:
mweir145 wrote:
The Miner Part 2 wrote:retarded.

Kyle: Anybody who thinks 9/11 was a conspiracy is a retard.
Cartman: Oh, really? Well, did you know that over one-fourth of people in America think that 9/11 was a conspiracy? Are you saying that one-fourth of Americans are retards?
Kyle: Yes, I'm saying one-fourth of Americans are retards.
Stan: Yeah, at least one-fourth.

:-b


;-D


Kyle (I think): Let's take a quick poll. There are four of us, and your (points to Cartman) a retard. That's one-fourth.

Ha. About the actual conspiracy stuff, although I don't like the Bush Administration at all, I don't think there's any 9/11 thing, although to be honest, I wouldn't be too surprised at all if there was. I personally just find it too hard to believe, and the "proof" is often contradicted.


Are you kidding? Bush barely has a grasp on the English language, you think he could have planned, AND covered this up? Give me a break, conspiracy theories are, in a word (as been said) "wee todd ed."
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Postby JTWood » Sat Dec 02, 2006 10:47 pm

Ugh... These threads pop up every few months it seems!

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I've said it before, and I'll say it again: If you can convince me that the government comes out ahead by destroying both it's own financial and military headquarters, only then will I start believing a possible conspiracy.

And that's a relatively light requirement. I'm not even asking for an explanation of where all of the plane passengers ended up at, why the government would kill their own military leaders in order to start a war, or how a government that can't even protect a major port (New Orleans) from an obvious disaster can meticulously plan a time-sensitive operation over hundreds of miles executed at a near-flawless level with only scant evidence remaining.

I'm asking bare minimum there...
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Postby Coppermine » Sat Dec 02, 2006 11:01 pm

JTWood wrote:Ugh... These threads pop up every few months it seems!

Image

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: If you can convince me that the government comes out ahead by destroying both it's own financial and military headquarters, only then will I start believing a possible conspiracy.

And that's a relatively light requirement. I'm not even asking for an explanation of where all of the plane passengers ended up at, why the government would kill their own military leaders in order to start a war, or how a government that can't even protect a major port (New Orleans) from an obvious disaster can meticulously plan a time-sensitive operation over hundreds of miles executed at a near-flawless level with only scant evidence remaining.

I'm asking bare minimum there...


Yeah, motive alone is sketchy at best, non-existent at worst.

I mean, just ignoring all of the contradictory evidence against a conspiracy theory with this, the planning for an attack like this would have had to start with the Clinton administration and then continue into the Bush admin, which pretty much replaced everyone involved in the highest level of government, most notably Richard Clark, the foremost terrorism expert in the government at the time.

My favorite argument FOR the conspiracy is the "squibs" or puffs of smoke that appear as the towers are collapsing, but just below the actual crumbling. What people don't understand is that the WTC towers were constructed uniquely, where almost all of the load bearing was on the outside walls. If the towers began to collapse, the floors below the collapse would start a pancaking effect that would displace a ridiculous amount of air, therefore easily explaining the "squibs" that conspiracy theorists claim are explosive charges. Whatever.

Several eyewitnesses claimed that the express elevators actually fell to the ground floor, explaining the damage to the lobby before the collapse of the towers. Yet, they're ignored and the 2 "eyewitnesses" who claim that it HAD to be explosives are the only ones given any credibility. Geez, people.

Speaking of, there's another video called "Eyewitness" that's even more absurd (and boring) than Loose Change. It's all the opinion of some software programmer who makes these ridiculous claims that people believe for some reason. It's such a sham.
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Postby suppasonic » Sun Dec 03, 2006 12:19 am

For things like this, I turn to a quote by Mr. Michael Shermer that says that for something unbelievable to be true (9/11 conspiracy, alien abductions, etc.), it would have to be even more unbelievable if the converse was true.

IE, for the 9/11 conspiracy to hold any water, it would have to be even more unbelievable that the government DIDN'T plan the attacks, which surely isn't the case. It's people like the creators of loose change that dont have any sense at all.
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Postby Snakes Gould » Sun Dec 03, 2006 12:26 am

yeah, i mean, ive heard conspiracies about 9/11 before but i never did any research so i was never sure. i certainly do not believe our own government did this, but a lot of things just seemed, uhhh "off" with everything. i knew the movie would have tons of inaccuracies but i just didnt bother to look any of their "facts" up. i respect all of your opinions and they all seem to make sense...id love to see someone who DOES think everything isnt how the government explained it say something here and there....

im not a big political guy and i dont mean to start any kind of anti-bush or political debate really. i was just curious about 9/11 in particular.
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Postby teddy ballgame » Sun Dec 03, 2006 12:30 am

suppasonic wrote:Yes, I've seen it. And all I have to say is that there are still people that actually believe that we landed on the moon, that Oswald somehow shot Kennedy, and that Area 51 doesn't exist. What idiots.

Funny, because I find people who think we didn't land on the moon to be idiots. ;-D

About 9/11. I definitely think that the government had chances to stop it, but didn't take it seriously or whatever and dropped the ball. I certainly don't think they planned the attacks though.
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Postby Coppermine » Sun Dec 03, 2006 2:27 am

teddy ballgame wrote:
suppasonic wrote:Yes, I've seen it. And all I have to say is that there are still people that actually believe that we landed on the moon, that Oswald somehow shot Kennedy, and that Area 51 doesn't exist. What idiots.

Funny, because I find people who think we didn't land on the moon to be idiots. ;-D

About 9/11. I definitely think that the government had chances to stop it, but didn't take it seriously or whatever and dropped the ball. I certainly don't think they planned the attacks though.


If you don't think we landed on the moon... then intelligent discussion is probably out for you ;-D

In 40 years, no one has yet to produce even probable evidence to suggest the moon landing was fake. Yet millions of Americans believe it was fake, if not because of a general misunderstanding or lack of self-actualization, then because of an unhealthy obsession with "The X-Files."
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Postby Snakes Gould » Sun Dec 03, 2006 2:39 am

Coppermine wrote:
teddy ballgame wrote:
suppasonic wrote:Yes, I've seen it. And all I have to say is that there are still people that actually believe that we landed on the moon, that Oswald somehow shot Kennedy, and that Area 51 doesn't exist. What idiots.

Funny, because I find people who think we didn't land on the moon to be idiots. ;-D
About 9/11. I definitely think that the government had chances to stop it, but didn't take it seriously or whatever and dropped the ball. I certainly don't think they planned the attacks though.


If you don't think we landed on the moon... then intelligent discussion is probably out for you ;-D

In 40 years, no one has yet to produce even probable evidence to suggest the moon landing was fake. Yet millions of Americans believe it was fake, if not because of a general misunderstanding or lack of self-actualization, then because of an unhealthy obsession with "The X-Files."


im pretty that means that he thinks people who believe that we DIDNT land on the moon fake are idiots, hence him believing in us landing on the moon :-?
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Postby Coppermine » Sun Dec 03, 2006 2:43 am

Snakes Gould wrote:
Coppermine wrote:
teddy ballgame wrote:
suppasonic wrote:Yes, I've seen it. And all I have to say is that there are still people that actually believe that we landed on the moon, that Oswald somehow shot Kennedy, and that Area 51 doesn't exist. What idiots.

Funny, because I find people who think we didn't land on the moon to be idiots. ;-D
About 9/11. I definitely think that the government had chances to stop it, but didn't take it seriously or whatever and dropped the ball. I certainly don't think they planned the attacks though.


If you don't think we landed on the moon... then intelligent discussion is probably out for you ;-D

In 40 years, no one has yet to produce even probable evidence to suggest the moon landing was fake. Yet millions of Americans believe it was fake, if not because of a general misunderstanding or lack of self-actualization, then because of an unhealthy obsession with "The X-Files."


im pretty that means that he thinks people who believe that we DIDNT land on the moon fake are idiots, hence him believing in us landing on the moon :-?


actually i think it just means you may have been drinking as much as I have tonight, from your response :-D

I'm ok with anyone thinking that the moon landing was fake... there's at least motive... Kennedy said we're landing on the moon by the end of the decade and curiously we made it "just in time." that said, let's say I'm from Missouri. Someone is going to have to prove it to me with something other than ambiguously placed shadows and expert-disputed lighting.
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Postby suppasonic » Sun Dec 03, 2006 2:45 am

In case anyone didn't catch the sarcasm...I was kidding.
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