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Interesting repercussions on US internet gambling "ban"

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Postby Madison » Sat Nov 18, 2006 12:28 pm

Coppermine wrote:I'm sorry, everyone must have a different definition of gambling than I do: wagering money or something of material value on an event with an uncertain outcome with the primary intent of winning additional money or material goods. Backgammon is a skill game, but as soon as a player makes a bet on it, it's gambling.

Poker is a game of skill, but you're still betting money on an uncertain outcome. And no matter how good you are, there's always someone better. All because it's a skill game doesn't mean it's not gambling.

Tell it to the minister's son in Connecticut who robbed a bank to pay off $5000 in online poker debts.


If poker was gambling, then why is it the people with less skill always lose in the long run, and the people with skill always win in the long run?

Poker is not a slot machine, where any idiot can pull the lever and win since no one has any control over anything. There's a whole lot more skill in poker.
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Postby Coppermine » Sat Nov 18, 2006 12:31 pm

Madison wrote:
Coppermine wrote:I'm sorry, everyone must have a different definition of gambling than I do: wagering money or something of material value on an event with an uncertain outcome with the primary intent of winning additional money or material goods. Backgammon is a skill game, but as soon as a player makes a bet on it, it's gambling.

Poker is a game of skill, but you're still betting money on an uncertain outcome. And no matter how good you are, there's always someone better. All because it's a skill game doesn't mean it's not gambling.

Tell it to the minister's son in Connecticut who robbed a bank to pay off $5000 in online poker debts.


If poker was gambling, then why is it the people with less skill always lose in the long run, and the people with skill always win in the long run?

Poker is not a slot machine, where any idiot can pull the lever and win since no one has any control over anything. There's a whole lot more skill in poker.


It's gambling because money is being wagered; you're basically betting on yourself that you're better than the other players. Sometimes you are, sometimes your not. Gambling just means money is bet, period... not that the house has some sort of advantage.

I mean, if the players of high skill always win, and the players of low skill always lose, in the long run, then isn't at least the players of low skill gambling? They probably know they suck, but they're taking a chance by making bets and losing money. And if they don't even realize they suck, well, that's what gambling's all about! That's gambling baby.

Yeah, I'd rather play some pachinko!
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Postby RyanK » Sat Nov 18, 2006 12:44 pm

Coppermine wrote:Tell it to the minister's son in Connecticut who robbed a bank to pay off $5000 in online poker debts.



No worries Im still here ;-D
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Postby Madison » Sat Nov 18, 2006 12:45 pm

Coppermine wrote:It's gambling because money is being wagered; you're basically betting on yourself that you're better than the other players. Sometimes you are, sometimes your not. Gambling just means money is bet, period... not that the house has some sort of advantage.

I mean, if the players of high skill always win, and the players of low skill always lose, in the long run, then isn't at least the players of low skill gambling? They probably know they suck, but they're taking a chance by making bets and losing money. And if they don't even realize they suck, well, that's what gambling's all about! That's gambling baby.

Yeah, I'd rather play some pachinko!


Money doesn't automatically make it gambling. If I bet you $100 that you cannot swallow your own head, and you accept, are either of us gambling? I'm not because you cannot swallow your own head, and you're not, you're just crazy. :-b

Money exchanging hands does not constitute gambling. ;-)
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Postby Coppermine » Sat Nov 18, 2006 12:49 pm

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Postby Snakes Gould » Sat Nov 18, 2006 1:33 pm

yeah, once you start playing consistently and you know more often than not that you're going to win, i dont consider it gambling...i play often, and i know im going to win more than i lose..PERIOD, although i have a roommate who isnt as good as me, he knows it, but he still plays alot..he can either lose alot or win alot but never one or the other consistently. i definitely consider him to be "gambling".
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Postby Tavish » Sat Nov 18, 2006 2:50 pm

Snakes Gould wrote:yeah, once you start playing consistently and you know more often than not that you're going to win, i dont consider it gambling...i play often, and i know im going to win more than i lose..PERIOD, although i have a roommate who isnt as good as me, he knows it, but he still plays alot..he can either lose alot or win alot but never one or the other consistently. i definitely consider him to be "gambling".


I have several friend who bet every Saturday/Sunday on football games and they consistently win more than they lose. I would still consider that to be gambling.
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Postby Madison » Sat Nov 18, 2006 7:17 pm

How would a tournament poker player be any different than a tennis player or golfer? Do poorly, you lose, and you don't make any money. Do well, and you cash in.

Are golfers and tennis players gamblers? :-?
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Postby Tavish » Sat Nov 18, 2006 7:54 pm

Madison wrote:How would a tournament poker player be any different than a tennis player or golfer? Do poorly, you lose, and you don't make any money. Do well, and you cash in.

Are golfers and tennis players gamblers? :-?


If the purse for a golf tournament was made from each golfer putting $100,000 into a pool, then yes they would be gambling. Almost every golf course has rules specifically prohibiting wagering on holes or matches because it is gambling.

You can gamble on games of skill the same as you can gamble on games of chance. If Pete Rose managed the Reds poorly he would have been fired from his job and wouldn't make any money. He wasn't gambling on baseball until he bet money on the outcome of games.

http://wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=gambling

# S: (n) gambling, gaming, play (the act of playing for stakes in the hope of winning (including the payment of a price for a chance to win a prize)) "his gambling cost him a fortune"; "there was heavy play at the blackjack table"
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Postby Coppermine » Sat Nov 18, 2006 10:37 pm

Yeah, pro tennis players and golfers don't really front the prize money; that's provided by advertisers. If, say, an amateur golf tournament has an entry fee then I would consider that gambling.

The word gambling has such a narrow and negative connotation; people hear gambling and immediately think of addiction, the plight of Atlantic City, Pete Rose's moral torpidity and people blowing their kids' college money on blackjack. It's really simple though; you front money for the chance to win more money and possibility of losing it, that's gambling. Doesn't matter what the venue is.
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