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Kenny Rogers with pine tar on hand...???

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Postby RyanK » Tue Oct 24, 2006 12:12 am

wrveres wrote:
j_d_mcnugent wrote:Image


Just thought of something.
Look at the build up on his thumb.
Now try and touch the palm of your hand with your thumb. ..
Go ahead ..

try it.

:-)

the stuff is on the brim of his cap

guilty!


good eye..

I dont think its that big a deal... Shoe Less Joe him..
Image
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Postby Big Pimpin » Tue Oct 24, 2006 12:13 am

Another Blown Save wrote:Article on SI.com


Interesting quote from this article...

"I bet Tony La Russa's pitchers are mad at him for saying anything, because a lot of guys do it, and I'd be surprise if there's a whole staff of guys who don't do it. In fact, I'd say a majority of guys use one of the three -- shaving cream, suntan lotion or pine tar. They can't like him ratting out the other team when everyone does it. Maybe he had to say something because it's the World Series, it's on TV and he probably has to answer to his owner."


There's more to this story than meets the eye. ;-)
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Postby JTWood » Tue Oct 24, 2006 12:43 am

Big Pimpin wrote:
Another Blown Save wrote:Article on SI.com


Interesting quote from this article...

"I bet Tony La Russa's pitchers are mad at him for saying anything, because a lot of guys do it, and I'd be surprise if there's a whole staff of guys who don't do it. In fact, I'd say a majority of guys use one of the three -- shaving cream, suntan lotion or pine tar. They can't like him ratting out the other team when everyone does it. Maybe he had to say something because it's the World Series, it's on TV and he probably has to answer to his owner."


There's more to this story than meets the eye. ;-)

There may be, and if it turned out our staff was cheating, too, I'd be even more pissed off.
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Postby RynMan » Tue Oct 24, 2006 12:44 am

Big Pimpin wrote:
Another Blown Save wrote:Article on SI.com


Interesting quote from this article...

"I bet Tony La Russa's pitchers are mad at him for saying anything, because a lot of guys do it, and I'd be surprise if there's a whole staff of guys who don't do it. In fact, I'd say a majority of guys use one of the three -- shaving cream, suntan lotion or pine tar. They can't like him ratting out the other team when everyone does it. Maybe he had to say something because it's the World Series, it's on TV and he probably has to answer to his owner."


There's more to this story than meets the eye. ;-)


You'd think that these people would be able to format their articles with proper grammar, yes?
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Postby wrveres » Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:16 am

JTWood wrote: and if it turned out our staff was cheating, too, I'd be even more pissed off.

Your joking right?
you should enter one of these ;-7 so people don't take your post seriouslly. ;-7

There is precedent for this BTW.
Jay Howell I believe, was suspended for two days during the playoffs, after he was caught with pine tar.

It just takes alot of nads to walk out there with a big ol clump of it on your hand during the World Series.

Kenny got busted, that's all, And it just happened to be in front of the whole world, during baseballs most important competition. Thats all. :-)
All those commentators from <insert ex city here> that said Kenny was not a very smart man, were correct.

It is kinda funny.
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Postby JTWood » Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:18 am

wrveres wrote:
JTWood wrote: and if it turned out our staff was cheating, too, I'd be even more pissed off.

Your joking right?
you should enter one of these ;-7 so people don't take your post seriouslly. ;-7

Why shouldn't I be pissed if it turned out that Jeff Weaver's sudden turnaround was due to him cheating?
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Postby wrveres » Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:33 am

JTWood wrote:
wrveres wrote:
JTWood wrote: and if it turned out our staff was cheating, too, I'd be even more pissed off.

Your joking right?
you should enter one of these ;-7 so people don't take your post seriouslly. ;-7

Why shouldn't I be pissed if it turned out that Jeff Weaver's sudden turnaround was due to him cheating?


I would guess that there is at least two to three people on every staff that cheat in this form, one way or another.
The problem here is that it happened on a massive stage.
It opened Pandoras Box.
Every home in America has an 8x10 glossy of Kenny Rogers with pinetar on his fingers. And if you don't, I'll send ya one. :-)

If baseball plans on truly cracking down on this form of cheating, they have a perfect opportunity to do so now, while they have the publics attention. I am guessing they will do nothing and hope it goes away, I just don't see it happening ..

IMO the pressure is squarely on Kenny Rogers, and all the Tigers now. If he goes out and gets shelled in game 6, not only will this whole series will be tainted, but all the good will that the Tigers have built this year, is gone.

Tony has admitted to seeing it on Kennys hands during the Oakland and Yankee series. He spotted it while viewing game tape. It is only a matter of hours now, till those pictures surface. This is only going to get bigger

If Kenny gets shelled, this series is tainted.
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Postby ukrneal » Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:01 am

Why has noone seemed to pick up on LaRussa's comment that all pitchers are doing this to some degree or another? Sounds like most pitchers are cheating in MLB based on some of the extreme postitions being taken here. I think you are letting your eyes deceive you. You are interpretting the evidence the way you want to.
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Postby Havok1517 » Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:11 am

RyanK wrote:
wrveres wrote:
j_d_mcnugent wrote:Image


Just thought of something.
Look at the build up on his thumb.
Now try and touch the palm of your hand with your thumb. ..
Go ahead ..

try it.

:-)

the stuff is on the brim of his cap

guilty!


good eye..

I dont think its that big a deal... Shoe Less Joe him..


Maybe he had a wipingaccident and was to embarrassed to tell the truth? Would explain why nobody touched it to find out for sure what it was. lol :-° (something smells though) lol sorry
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Postby ukrneal » Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:50 am

Article from the New York Times (very interesting):

ST. LOUIS, Oct. 23 — Gaylord Perry, that master of doctoring a baseball who was just as much a master of making batters think he was doctoring it, has no doubt about what Kenny Rogers smeared across the palm of his left hand in the World Series.

Gaylord Perry, an admitted spitballer, says he knows what was on Kenny Rogers’s hand.
Perry laughed at Rogers’s explanation that it was dirt.

Perry, the man who was defined by the spitball, and by all of the histrionics that accompanied throwing it or not throwing it, watched Rogers pitching for the Detroit Tigers on Sunday. Perry said he immediately detected that the brown smudge on Rogers’s hand was from a well-known sticky substance.

“Oh, well, he probably just used a little pine tar,” said Perry, sounding like a convivial, convincing Southern lawyer. “There’s nothing wrong with that.”

Then Perry, who lives in North Carolina, said Rogers could have kept his hand from getting discolored and kept his secret had he selected a different brand.

“If he got some North Carolina pine tar, that’s clear,” Perry said in a telephone interview. “You’ve got to know what you’re doing.”

For 22 entertaining years, Perry applied spit, Vaseline, baby oil, hair tonic and several other wet substances to the surface of the ball to help make it move more. Perry would adjust his cap, tug at his sleeves and rub his face and neck before unleashing a pitch, forcing hitters to think he was loading the ball with a foreign substance every time.

Since Perry vigorously stumps for pitchers who are seeking advantages, he was giddy about what he felt Rogers had done in taming the St. Louis Cardinals, 3-1, in Game 2. Perry said that pitchers use pine tar in chilly weather because the ball is slick and the stickiness allows them to have better control. The wind chill in Detroit was 30 degrees at game time.

But Perry said he never used pine tar to deface a ball; he preferred rosin, which is legal, to get a better grip. Perry, a Hall of Fame pitcher who won 314 games, does not blame Rogers for saying the substance on his hand was dirt. But neither does Perry believe Rogers.

“If it was dirt, something had to make it stick there,” Perry said. “Dirt isn’t just sticking there in cold weather.”

Television close-ups indicated that Rogers had something on his hand in the first inning, but he washed it off before the second and pitched seven more scoreless innings. Rogers reiterated on Monday that it was not pine tar. “It was mud, rosin, sweat and spit,” Rogers said. “It’s always there.”

As Rogers was surrounded by about 75 reporters, Todd Jones, Detroit’s closer, stood 50 feet away and said that he has used pine tar on balls during his career. Jones, who writes a column for The Sporting News, wrote in 2005 that he used it every time he pitched for the Colorado Rockies at Coors Field. Jones said the substance helped him grip the ball in the 5,000-foot elevation in Denver.

“My situation was, when I was in Denver, I had to have it or I wasn’t going to be worth anything,” Jones said. “In 2003, I had an 8 E.R.A. It didn’t help. It’s not an advantage. You’re just trying to break even.”

Jones said he stored the pine tar in his glove or on his hand or in other undisclosed places. Pitchers who are caught using pine tar on balls are ejected and suspended for 10 games.

“This is not brand new, guys,” Jones said. “It’s an accepted thing. I think there’s a difference between pine tar and Vaseline.”

Perry said that Rogers, by using pine tar, was not cheating and was “taking advantage” of a situation. Even though Rogers briefly had something on his hand, Perry said what might be even more relevant is what he planted in the hitters’ heads.

“He did his thing,” Perry said. “He got all the Cardinals thinking he was doing something with the ball. That’s half the game right there.”

As Perry watched Rogers on television, he felt a kinship with the pitcher who has morphed into an October force by throwing 23 scoreless innings in a row.

“I’m proud of him, man,” Perry said. “He did it to them. Good for him. Now you’ll have a thousand high school kids using pine tar, too.”

Perry joked that if the Cardinals wanted to know what was on Rogers’s hand, a hitter should have “just walked out and shook his hand to see if it was sticky.” Perry said the best strategy for the hitters would have been to move up as much as possible in the batter’s box and hit Rogers’s pitches before they broke.

When Rogers was asked about Perry, he called him a “great pitcher,” but he did not address the slippery method that helped make Perry memorable. Meanwhile, Perry reveled in discussing Rogers. Perry noted that he has white pine trees on his property and offered to send Rogers some of that North Carolina pine tar.

“This will probably stay with him,” Perry said. “It’s like the spitball has been for me. It’s stayed with me for the rest of my life.”
Last edited by ukrneal on Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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