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Steve Lyons fired by FOX

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Postby acsguitar » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:59 am

mikekim2121 wrote:
WOW. Joking that someone from a certain race is more likely to steal your wallet is NOT a critical comment. That is stereotyping, which can be taken as a form of racism.

If you really think that people should have complete freedom of speech on TV, do you also think that people should swear their asses off on ABC at 4 PM? Obviously this is extreme but do you think they should show lynchings and Klansmen talking negatively about other races on primetime TV?

Using your logic, people should have the right to say what they want no matter how bad it is.

You say that its their opinion and no one has to agree with it, which is certainly true. But that doesn't mean that is the right forum for them to voice their opinions.

I understand its a joke and I myself have said some negative things toward other races in humorous contexts with my friends but you don't do it on National TV during a baseball game. Go to Comedy Central and bust out all the se hablaing jokes you want.


The reason FOX or any TV stations make decisions are not because they are PC or because they are the "Right" or "Wrong" thing to do. If the audience wants to see clansmen burning flags or racist jokes then you can bet your arse they would be on TV. Fortunately they are not because the "Audience" doesn't want to see them and therefore will not watch the Show and therefore will not watch the Advertisements that sponser the show.

Fox fired Lyons because advertisers may object to the comments and pull their ads and funding from fox.

All forms of non-cable tv exist because of advertisers. Lyons was fired to save advertisers the hassle of getting letters from consumers saying "Please pull your ads Steve Lyons is a racist"
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Postby TheYanks04 » Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:44 pm

acsguitar wrote:
mikekim2121 wrote:
WOW. Joking that someone from a certain race is more likely to steal your wallet is NOT a critical comment. That is stereotyping, which can be taken as a form of racism.

If you really think that people should have complete freedom of speech on TV, do you also think that people should swear their asses off on ABC at 4 PM? Obviously this is extreme but do you think they should show lynchings and Klansmen talking negatively about other races on primetime TV?

Using your logic, people should have the right to say what they want no matter how bad it is.

You say that its their opinion and no one has to agree with it, which is certainly true. But that doesn't mean that is the right forum for them to voice their opinions.

I understand its a joke and I myself have said some negative things toward other races in humorous contexts with my friends but you don't do it on National TV during a baseball game. Go to Comedy Central and bust out all the se hablaing jokes you want.


The reason FOX or any TV stations make decisions are not because they are PC or because they are the "Right" or "Wrong" thing to do. If the audience wants to see clansmen burning flags or racist jokes then you can bet your arse they would be on TV. Fortunately they are not because the "Audience" doesn't want to see them and therefore will not watch the Show and therefore will not watch the Advertisements that sponser the show.

Fox fired Lyons because advertisers may object to the comments and pull their ads and funding from fox.

All forms of non-cable tv exist because of advertisers. Lyons was fired to save advertisers the hassle of getting letters from consumers saying "Please pull your ads Steve Lyons is a racist"



So as soon as someone might be offended it is time to throw momma off the train? Does not matter who is complaning, or how loudly or even if at all as in the case from what I have seen. Does not matter if that statement was not inciting or preaching violence or breaking any law. Where do you all what to draw the line and not have the PC police come after your job? Obviously Fox can do what it feels is in its best interest. Just hope you are never in a situation where your employer feels that it thinks you are not worthy of PC purity or piety and lets you go.

What if someone says a curse word on the air? Time to fire him for the offense because he might offend those with kids or the morally puritanical?

What if someone says he thinks Barry Bonds is a cheater and roid user? Oh my god, time to fire him too because the group of Bonds fans are upset and it could cost ratings?

What if someone makes a comment that he thinks Americans are poorly treated in some foreign city? Ut oh, he offends some people too....fire his behind.

Now one says Fox does not have the right to do what they did. If you want purely non-offensive, non-humorous, non-controverdsial and inane commentary in broadcasting, congratulations. It has been guaranteed for the foreseeable future with this. Joe Morgan is as good as it is ever going to get as anyone who might have an opinion is now going to keep his trap shut and just spew the usual drivel and cliches. They are all going to be Joe Buck clones.
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Postby GotowarMissAgnes » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:57 pm

TheYanks04 wrote:Now one says Fox does not have the right to do what they did. If you want purely non-offensive, non-humorous, non-controverdsial and inane commentary in broadcasting, congratulations. It has been guaranteed for the foreseeable future with this. Joe Morgan is as good as it is ever going to get as anyone who might have an opinion is now going to keep his trap shut and just spew the usual drivel and cliches. They are all going to be Joe Buck clones.


So my only options are offensive and humorous or respectful and inane?

Somehow, I think we can demand more as consumers, the ones who pay the bills.

How about we insist about a better product than Steve Lyons--like someone who is both funny and intelligent, but knows that they don't have to insult disabled people, Hispanic people, or Jewish people in order to be funny!
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Postby Coppermine » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:21 pm

acsguitar wrote:Here's a video clip..

sounds kinda dumb of him..

IT doesn't sound like he's trying to equate Spanish = Stealing.

However, it can be construed that way.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWf1a6O4hv8


Removed due to copyright infringement... I guess YouTube posted it with just implied oral consent
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Postby davidmarver » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:30 pm

If Lyons had straight-up said "hispanics are more likely to steal your wallet" that would be racism. However, there is a good amount of infering and implication by Fox that has led to his firing. If there wasn't a pre-existing stereotype that hispanics are thieves, no one would have taken any notice to his comment; only because Fox themselves has a pre-existing opinion and/or thought that hispanics are more likely to steal did Lyons get fired. That, the act of firing Lyons, is more indicative of racism than anything Lyons has ever said on air.
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Postby Absolutely Adequate » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:58 pm

davidmarver wrote:If Lyons had straight-up said "hispanics are more likely to steal your wallet" that would be racism. However, there is a good amount of infering and implication by Fox that has led to his firing. If there wasn't a pre-existing stereotype that hispanics are thieves, no one would have taken any notice to his comment; only because Fox themselves has a pre-existing opinion and/or thought that hispanics are more likely to steal did Lyons get fired. That, the act of firing Lyons, is more indicative of racism than anything Lyons has ever said on air.


Eww... You're a Padres' fan? Let me move over here.... Let me make sure nobody has been groping my butt....


What? You took that personally? You've simply inferred due to your pre-existing prejudice. Clearly, this is all your fault.


-Honest to God: That might be the worst argument I've ever heard. And I've read Mookie's posts!
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Postby wrveres » Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:45 am

davidmarver wrote:If Lyons had straight-up said "hispanics are more likely to steal your wallet" that would be racism. However, there is a good amount of infering and implication by Fox that has led to his firing. If there wasn't a pre-existing stereotype that hispanics are thieves, no one would have taken any notice to his comment; only because Fox themselves has a pre-existing opinion and/or thought that hispanics are more likely to steal did Lyons get fired. That, the act of firing Lyons, is more indicative of racism than anything Lyons has ever said on air.

I stongly disagree ..

Lyons was not fired for "one" act.
It was a repeated behavior.
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Postby Dawgpound 1613 » Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:31 am

mikekim2121 wrote:Using your logic, people should have the right to say what they want no matter how bad it is.


Actually, they do. It is called the 1st Amendment.

You may have to deal with the consequcnes, but you have the right to say anything.

My main objection to this is that it just continues the double standard. If Dusty Baker or Ozzie Guillen had said this, nothing would have been done despite having made previous statements in the past that were "worse" (i.e. having a history as well).

In the end, I think Lyons was let go for the culmination of several statements and to avoid the risk he might say something really offensive in a future game. He obviously had shown himself to be stupid and I just don't think Fox wanted to take that risk and used this "controversy" as the reason to get rid of him now.
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Postby mikekim2121 » Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:52 am

Dawgpound 1613 wrote:
mikekim2121 wrote:Using your logic, people should have the right to say what they want no matter how bad it is.


Actually, they do. It is called the 1st Amendment.

You may have to deal with the consequcnes, but you have the right to say anything.


Yeah you are right. You can say what you want but then you shouldn't question why you were fired.

I wasn't talking about from a straight up Constitutional standpoint, I was talking about what you can and can't say on TV and other forms of mainstream mass media.
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Postby GotowarMissAgnes » Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:34 am

davidmarver wrote:If Lyons had straight-up said "hispanics are more likely to steal your wallet" that would be racism. However, there is a good amount of infering and implication by Fox that has led to his firing. If there wasn't a pre-existing stereotype that hispanics are thieves, no one would have taken any notice to his comment; only because Fox themselves has a pre-existing opinion and/or thought that hispanics are more likely to steal did Lyons get fired. That, the act of firing Lyons, is more indicative of racism than anything Lyons has ever said on air.


Sorry, but in no rational universe does that make sense. Other than John Rocker, most people today carefully couch their racism or are hardly even aware that they hold such biased opinions. We can only infer what Lyons meant. What we know is that in the space of one sentence he was talking about people "hablaing Esapnol" and being concerned about his "missing wallet". That's got nothing to do with other people's pre-existing stereotypes and a lot to do with Steve Lyons' actions.
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