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Postby Chrisy Moltisanti » Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:17 pm

He just proved all that stuff you said to be wrong... You think Hughes was on the downside during the GSP fight? OK, I can understand your reaction there. Regardless, Serra is the best in his division by a mile right now. Over four years ago, when Serra's ground skills were worse and he didn't even have a stand up game, he took a primed BJ Penn to a full three rounds in a decision. He definitely was underrated by me, and apparently by you guys, still. We just saw how Sanchez can't stand with anyone AND Serra can counter his ground game, Serra wins easily there. Koscheck would be a good matchup as both showed improved and dangerous stand up (lesser so in JK's case), but you saw how he didn't want to use his strength against a submission artist such as Diego, whose ground skills are = or worse than Serra's. Stand up slight edge to Serra, slighter edge on the ground. I say Koshcheck vs Serra is the next fight we want.
Last edited by Chrisy Moltisanti on Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Chrisy Moltisanti » Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:21 pm

Amazinz wrote:I won't blow a gasket but I will agree with Mookie. Hughes is a nightmare matchup for Serra. Hughes is a nightmare matchup for most fighters that have BJJ as a base (except BJ Penn) because he is so strong. Maybe Serra can get the flash knockout on Hughes the way he did GSP but other than that I think the fight ends badly for Serra. Don't hold the Lyttle fight against Hughes. He came in undersized and was very cautious due to coming off the loss to GSP. Oh and I have no problem admitting this but GSP is the perfect fighter to exploit Hughes because he is versatile and his wrestling is at an elite level.


I don't agree that BJJ artists such as Sanchez and Serra are so over matched by a strong wrestler. Koshcheck's wrestling skills are probably at Hughes level right now and he didn't' want any part of Diego on the ground.
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Postby Chrisy Moltisanti » Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:25 pm

Amazinz wrote:I won't blow a gasket but I will agree with Mookie. Hughes is a nightmare matchup for Serra. Hughes is a nightmare matchup for most fighters that have BJJ as a base (except BJ Penn) because he is so strong. Maybe Serra can get the flash knockout on Hughes the way he did GSP but other than that I think the fight ends badly for Serra. Don't hold the Lyttle fight against Hughes. He came in undersized and was very cautious due to coming off the loss to GSP. Oh and I have no problem admitting this but GSP is the perfect fighter to exploit Hughes because he is versatile and his wrestling is at an elite level.


To support my wrestler vs BJJ idea, note that despite the strong wrestling game you acknowledge GSP to have, he didn't want any part of Serra's ground game either.
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Postby Amazinz » Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:28 pm

Well I don't think Serra has proved me wrong yet. Don't get me wrong. I am a Serra fan just because of my Long Island roots and I would enjoy it if he did prove me wrong. But to say someone is the dominant force in a division because of one knockout is a little extreme IMO. We don't even know if Serra's stand-up has improved that dramatically. He may have just caught GSP cheating. Kevin Randleman beat Mirko Cro Cop the exact same way that Serra beat GSP. Also, I didn't say Hughes was on the downside when he lost to GSP. I said that his showing versus Lyttle was lackluster due to circumstance and the decision not to bulk up the way he has in the past.
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Postby Amazinz » Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:30 pm

Chrisy Moltisanti wrote:To support my wrestler vs BJJ idea, note that despite the strong wrestling game you acknowledge GSP to have, he didn't want any part of Serra's ground game either.

How do you know that? Certainly not from a fight that lasted less than a round.
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Postby Chrisy Moltisanti » Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:37 pm

Amazinz wrote:
Chrisy Moltisanti wrote:To support my wrestler vs BJJ idea, note that despite the strong wrestling game you acknowledge GSP to have, he didn't want any part of Serra's ground game either.

How do you know that? Certainly not from a fight that lasted less than a round.


Impression from the fight and post fight interviews. Sure it's not solid, but it can't be proven wrong, only mostly correct.

Bottom line: We have a very competitive division ;-D
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Postby Mookie4ever » Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:45 pm

Serra is a good wrestler I will admit but I was frankly shocked that he got the title shot. At that point he was 5-4 in his UFC career and the only distinguishing thing about him was the win on TUF and even that was a split decision. His record was unimpressive and he had only had one win that wasn't a decision.

He should not even be mentioned in the same breath as Hughes who has won the belt 3 times and defended his title 9 times. The guy is a living legend and deserves some respect.
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Postby J35J » Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:46 pm

GSP lost to Serra? Wow

Sanchez lost to Kosh? Wow


I'm surprised, wish I could have seen the fights live. I will have to look at youtube when I get home. I was very unimpressed with Serra when he was on the ulimate fighter..... :-? I didn't think he would stand a chance against GSP.

I figured Sanchez would handle Kosh ok as well. I just figured Kosh wasn't as experienced or had the versatility that Sanchez has?

I will admit that I'm not a big homer of MMA but I watch anytime I get a chance...... Anyway, very surprising!! For me anyway....
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Postby Chrisy Moltisanti » Tue Apr 10, 2007 3:01 pm

Mookie4ever wrote:Serra is a good wrestler I will admit but I was frankly shocked that he got the title shot. At that point he was 5-4 in his UFC career and the only distinguishing thing about him was the win on TUF and even that was a split decision. His record was unimpressive and he had only had one win that wasn't a decision.

He should not even be mentioned in the same breath as Hughes who has won the belt 3 times and defended his title 9 times. The guy is a living legend and deserves some respect.


Well Hughes is a mod edit - language edited so I don't give him all of his due.

Serra just earned the right to be mentioned in the same breath.

Somehow I think all of us allowed ourselves to illegitimately think Serra was a lesser fighter than he really was due to one super lucky spinning back hand.

Serra got the title shot because of a long standing agreement. If it was awarded I'd agree, but it wasn't. GSP certainly thought he was worthy before and after the fight. Did you hear the prefight comments? (paraphrase:) "I do not underestimate Matt Serra. To do so would be a fatal misteake. I trained as hard as ever and am in the best shape for a fight I ever have been." Post fight: "Tonight I was beaten by a better fighter. I'll have to come back stronger."

I'll take GSP's word for it. ;-)

PS- as these ground guys develop stand up games, they are getting pretty damn good. Had Zuffa not bought Pride, I'd say they'd now be close to their level across the board. Now it's hard to say who fights for who though :-b .
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Postby Amazinz » Tue Apr 10, 2007 3:09 pm

I never thought Serra was a lesser fighter at all, certainly not because of the Shonie fight. I think it was more the back-to-back losses to BJ Penn and Din Thomas that stamped my impression of him. I do think that Serra is more of a gatekeeper level talent though. His victory over GSP hasn't changed my opinion. If he beats Hughes than obviously I'll have to wake up and realize he's reinvented himself.

Serra has a 9-4 pro record.
Hughes has a 41-5 pro record.

Serra certainly earned the right to be talked about in that regard but it still has to be kept in perspective.
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