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Why don't they count HBP as a walk?

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Why don't they count HBP as a walk?

Postby The Jury » Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:04 pm

To my knowledge, the IBP only shows up in the box score through the pitcher's WHIP. I'd like a damn BB for my guy getting plunked, and a BB given up to the pitcher! :~(
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Postby Philliebuster » Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:17 pm

cbs.sportsline leagues allow this
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Postby Matthias » Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:38 pm

My guess is it doesn't go into OBP b/c a walk you at least draw. Even if the pitcher is really wild, you at least knew enough not to swing at it. Whereas a HBP all you did was not get out of the way. So whereas a BB reflects poorly on the pitcher and positively on the hitter, a HBP is only poor on the pitcher's part.
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Re: Why don't they count HBP as a walk?

Postby Big Pimpin » Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:40 pm

The Jury wrote:To my knowledge, the IBP only shows up in the box score through the pitcher's WHIP. I'd like a damn BB for my guy getting plunked, and a BB given up to the pitcher! :~(


HBP doesn't even show up in the pitcher's WHIP. It's walks plus hits divided by IP, and a HBP doesn't classify as either. It does show up in a hitter's OBP though ( [H + BB + HBP] / [AB + BB + HBP + SF] ). ;-D
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Re: Why don't they count HBP as a walk?

Postby jnormy » Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:47 pm

Big Pimpin wrote:
The Jury wrote:To my knowledge, the IBP only shows up in the box score through the pitcher's WHIP. I'd like a damn BB for my guy getting plunked, and a BB given up to the pitcher! :~(


HBP doesn't even show up in the pitcher's WHIP. It's walks plus hits divided by IP, and a HBP doesn't classify as either. It does show up in a hitter's OBP though ( [H + BB + HBP] / [AB + BB + HBP + SF] ). ;-D


It can definitely work in your favor, as it did for me last night in my points league. Cotts (my pitcher) comes in to face Giambi with bases loaded and Jeter (my SS) on third. Cotts hits Giambi, thus scoring Jeter and gaining me a point. Meanwhile, it doesn't cost Cotts anything. Then he gets Posada to hit into a DP to gain me some more points. I was loving the HBP rule in that game! ;-D
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Postby WhiteHot » Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:50 pm

Things I don't get about baseball:

1. A HBP isn't considered a BB. It's a base on a ball...that hit him.
2. A BB isn't considered an AB, but you can get an RBI from an BB. How can you "bat" a guy in without an AB?
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Postby jnormy » Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:52 pm

WhiteHot wrote:2. A BB isn't considered an AB, but you can get an RBI from an BB. How can you "bat" a guy in without an AB?


Strangely enough, there are two ways... a walk, and a sacrifice fly. :-?
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Postby Big Pimpin » Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:56 pm

jnormy wrote:
WhiteHot wrote:2. A BB isn't considered an AB, but you can get an RBI from an BB. How can you "bat" a guy in without an AB?


Strangely enough, there are two ways... a walk, and a sacrifice fly. :-?


I think there are even more than two... BB and SF, yes, but also a normal sacrifice (like a suicide squeeze) as well as HBP with the bases loaded...

What I don't understand is why a sac fly counts towards the denominator of OBP, but a sacrifice doesn't.
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Postby GotowarMissAgnes » Wed Aug 09, 2006 5:06 pm

Big Pimpin wrote:
jnormy wrote:
WhiteHot wrote:2. A BB isn't considered an AB, but you can get an RBI from an BB. How can you "bat" a guy in without an AB?


Strangely enough, there are two ways... a walk, and a sacrifice fly. :-?


I think there are even more than two... BB and SF, yes, but also a normal sacrifice (like a suicide squeeze) as well as HBP with the bases loaded...

What I don't understand is why a sac fly counts towards the denominator of OBP, but a sacrifice doesn't.


From Wiki:

"Bunts (sacrifice hits since 1954), which would lower a batter's on base percentage, are not included in the calculation for on base percentage, as bunting is an offensive strategy – often dictated by the manager – the use of which does not necessarily reflect on the batter's ability and should not be used to penalize him."
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Postby Big Pimpin » Wed Aug 09, 2006 5:08 pm

GotowarMissAgnes wrote:
Big Pimpin wrote:
jnormy wrote:
WhiteHot wrote:2. A BB isn't considered an AB, but you can get an RBI from an BB. How can you "bat" a guy in without an AB?


Strangely enough, there are two ways... a walk, and a sacrifice fly. :-?


I think there are even more than two... BB and SF, yes, but also a normal sacrifice (like a suicide squeeze) as well as HBP with the bases loaded...

What I don't understand is why a sac fly counts towards the denominator of OBP, but a sacrifice doesn't.


From Wiki:

"Bunts (sacrifice hits since 1954), which would lower a batter's on base percentage, are not included in the calculation for on base percentage, as bunting is an offensive strategy – often dictated by the manager – the use of which does not necessarily reflect on the batter's ability and should not be used to penalize him."


Right, but couldn't a sac fly be construed the same way? It's a strategy to get a runner home, right? Heck, if you've ever seen a guy strike out with one out and a guy on third you realize it's not a given to just a hit a fly ball to the OF in that situation...

That's all I'm saying...
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