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HoF Debate: Jeff Bagwell

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Postby Belle4Hall88 » Thu Jul 13, 2006 2:58 pm

Belle isnt in and he has better #'s than Bags
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Postby DK » Thu Jul 13, 2006 3:01 pm

Belle4Hall88 wrote:Belle isnt in and he has better #'s than Bags


No he doesn't. Bagwell has much better numbers than Belle.

I'd put Bagwell in the Hall, definitely. It might be hard for him because even though he was a more complete hitter than a lot of his contemporaries, he didn't put up 50+ HR a year so he wasn't talked about as much. Also he doesn't have 500 HR and his career fell off after age 35 which will bring his chances down a bit.

I'd bet he gets in the actual HoF but it'll be more difficult for him that it should be.
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Postby DK » Thu Jul 13, 2006 3:02 pm

He also has 200 SB's. It's so weird hearing about people you'd never think as speedy stealing bags.

Tony Gwynn once stole 56 bases in a year. Crazy. 8-o
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Postby joshheines » Thu Jul 13, 2006 3:12 pm

Belle4Hall88 wrote:Belle isnt in and he has better #'s than Bags


Belle was filthy hitter in four seasons, three more above average seasons, and two more pretty good seasons. Belle played awful defense.

Belle only had 4 HOF seasons and his career was not spectacular outside of those seasons.
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Postby RAmst23 » Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:21 pm

I love Bagwell as a player, but I wouldn't put him in the Hall of Fame. Bagwell put up some excellent offensive years, however those years were put up in a very offensive minded time. While an excellent player overall, Bagwell wasn't dominating throughout those 5 seasons.

IMO if you put Bagwell in the hall, then too many others with like statistics have to be considered as well (Fred McGriff for instance). The Hall of Fame is supposed to separate the best from the rest, and not clump all the very goods in with the greats.
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Postby wkelly91 » Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:26 pm

IMO...the Hall should be raising the bar rather than lowering it. There are players in now who shouldn't be...there are many on the bubble who shouldn't be....Bagwell is on the bubble...and shouldn't be.

Sorry Bags fans.....NO }:-)
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Postby joshheines » Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:55 pm

I don't understand the McGriff/Bagwell comparisons.

McGriff's top 5 OPS and adjusted OPS seasons are:
1.012, .957, .950, .930, .930 and career OPS of .886
165, 161, 157, 157, 157 - Adjusted OPS

Bags numbers dwarf him:
1.201, 1.045, 1.039, 1.021, 1.017 (Bagwell's fifth best season is roughly equivalent to McGriff's far and away best season)
213, 179, 169, 168, 158 - Adjusted OPS

Guys most similar to Bags include: Gary Sheffield, Frank Thomas, Ken Griffey, WIllie Stargell, Mickey Mantle, Eddiw Murray, Duke Snider, Reggie Jackson, Mike Schmidt, Carl Yaz and Frank Robinson.
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Postby CheeseBeger » Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:56 pm

Yes I also think the Hall should be raising the bar. When I think of the Hall of Famers from a certain generation I want them to be those people will continue to say "Wow he was so great." If FBC had control I agree it would become the Hall of Very Good.


I say no to Bagwell.
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Postby ttwarrior1 » Thu Jul 13, 2006 4:59 pm

bagwell will make it because their arent that many good young playes that will end up playing long enough to make the hall of fame. He wont be a 1st ballot but a good 3rd ballot. There will be some years when there is no great 1st ballot hall of famer on the list to select and bagwell would then make it.
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Postby stevekahuda » Thu Jul 13, 2006 5:00 pm

Thanks joshheines, that was very informative
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