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Fundamental baseball is becoming a lost art

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Postby RyanK » Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:50 am

[quote="TheYanks04"]Like this is news? No one can lay a bunt down these days. Players are swinging for the fences late in games with runners on second and third down 2 runs instead of trying to get a single, advancing a runner to third from second when there is no one out is almost unheard of [quote]


This is true.. but when i was at the Sox-Mets game.. they were tied 2-2 in the 8th, Coco bunted for a hit, stole second, Cora or Gonzalez bunted him to third, then Youk hit a sac fly to score him to give the sox the lead 3-2

So small ball does still exist to some extent
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Postby johnsamo » Sat Jul 08, 2006 3:14 am

It's a generational thing, the NBA and basketball used to be pretty mediocre until Larry Bird and Magic came around and suddenly passing was cool.

I occassionally go to a high school games out here in California, and let me tell you, these kids are solid on the fundamentals. Way more than when I was at that level. Nearly all the good young teens now go to these baseball academies in the summer and they're even creating private little leagues where the best players come and compete, and they are producing virtual clones of todays stars. The whole point of these academies and leagues is to produce Major league players. You can't even get into some until you're already good. And the quality of coaching these kids is get is way above the level I was as a kid. A lot of them played in the show.

You can watch a game and pick out the Jeters, The A-Rods, the Pujols, the Ichiros, etc. These kids are being taught to model the guys that play hard. If you see a Manny clone, it's just his swing. Dogging it at this level well get you on the pine quick. The coaches are like Generals and the kids do what they're told. It's almost scary. It's like the Stepford wives but with cleats. But the kids are really good. some of these high schools in the burbs, every kid they start will probably at least be a Division 1 player.
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Postby baseballboy » Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:15 pm

Chrisy Moltisanti wrote:You're wrong about A. Jones. He doesn't dive often or look like he hustles because he doesn't have to and when he does it's because he couldn't get to it. To many players get late jumps or are lazy, then accelerate and jump to make their catches look more spectacular than they should have been. A. Jones is the best CF I've ever seen IRL and on film.

I don't doubt Jones' ability as a great CF. However, this post was originally posted by myself after seeing none other then an Andrew Jones at bat yesterday. If you saw the play, he hit a shot to 3B that was hit so hard it came out of the 3B glove and rolled about 8 feet into foul territory. Jones was lollygagging it to 1B while the 3B (none other then the always-hussling Ryan Freel) got the ball and threw out Jones. This is the kind of stuff that saddens me - a GREAT player like Jones giving up on the play. Had he ran hard the whole way he gets there with ease.
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Postby Purple Haze » Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:18 pm

TheYanks04 wrote:Like this is news? No one can lay a bunt down these days. Players are swinging for the fences late in games with runners on second and third down 2 runs instead of trying to get a single, advancing a runner to third from second when there is no one out is almost unheard of, the K numbers of the sluggers have reached ridiculous levels (go back and check the K numbers of guys like Berra and Dimaggio by comparison).

Joe D in his 13 year MLB career K'ed a total of 369 times. He often walked more than he K'ed. In 1948 he hit 39 Hrs, 155 rbis, walked 67 times and K'ed all of 30 times. Adam Dunn will K 30 times in about 1 month. Berra in 19 MLB years K'ed all of 414 times (about 22 a season). Back then striking out was considered bad. Nowadays if a guy keeps the ks under 150, no one even notices.

Not putting the ball in play is fundamentally BAD baseball. Mantle, who in his era was criticized for his K rate never had more than 126 Ks in a season. Indeed he K'ed 1710 times in 18 seasons. By today's standard that is nothing and would not even be noticed. Today, you see guys like Dunn K 170+. Arod Ks 130 routinely.


THANK YOU... ;-D
was wondering why this was even a question today in 2006...hahaha Not a NEW thing :-o
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Postby suppasonic » Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:26 pm

TheYanks04 wrote:Joe D in his 13 year MLB career K'ed a total of 369 times. He often walked more than he K'ed. In 1948 he hit 39 Hrs, 155 rbis, walked 67 times and K'ed all of 30 times. Adam Dunn will K 30 times in about 1 month. Berra in 19 MLB years K'ed all of 414 times (about 22 a season). Back then striking out was considered bad. Nowadays if a guy keeps the ks under 150, no one even notices.

Not putting the ball in play is fundamentally BAD baseball. Mantle, who in his era was criticized for his K rate never had more than 126 Ks in a season. Indeed he K'ed 1710 times in 18 seasons. By today's standard that is nothing and would not even be noticed. Today, you see guys like Dunn K 170+. Arod Ks 130 routinely.


And Joe D and Mantle were two of probably the 10 greatest hitters of all time. One of those types comes along once or twice a generation.

Tell the 2004 Red Sox that swinging for the fences was a bad idea. Their station-to-station, 3-run HR offense worked pretty well, I think.
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