Smokin' In The Drive Thru - Fantasy Baseball Cafe 2014 Fantasy Baseball Cafe
100% Deposit Bonus for Cafe Members!

Return to General Talk

Smokin' In The Drive Thru

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

Postby Field » Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:42 pm

Coppermine wrote:I hate the whole idea of "underage drinking." If we only lived in a society where parents assumed the responsibility of teaching their children the importance of responsibility while consuming alcohol, our society would be much better off. If a 16 year old living at home were given the privilage of a glass of wine here and a bottle of beer there, realization of the effects of alcohol would be much more widespread and DUI's would go down on their own while teenagers entering their college years would have a certain respect for alcohol rather than a ridiculous and unfettered fascination. Instead of demonizing alcohol to all people under 21 (while bombarding them with beer commercials about how cool it is to drunk) we should be laying a foundation for awareness.

My parents let me drink when I was under 21, in very limited and supervised amounts, and I'm better off for it. Then I go to college and Joe Schmo whose parents wouldn't let him touch booze get's trashed every night and drops out. I've seen it first hand.

Too bad America is way to irresponsible as a whole to adhere to such a simple concept.


I totally agree with this.
Field
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
Fantasy Expert
Posts: 2549
Joined: 4 Nov 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: NH

Postby bigh0rt » Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:42 pm

Field wrote:
bigh0rt wrote:
Field wrote:So pretty much if you're 19 and you have a 1/2 of a keystone light you are breaking the law which is pretty absurd


Remind me why it's absurd, again? Underage drinking (which is illegal) and driving should be anything other than zero tolerance? :-?


Did you really just pull out the zero tolerance card on this one? I mean no one has pulled out the if you can go to war in Iraq and die for your country but you still can't drink a legal beer one yet.

If you are 19 and have one beer and drive are you more of a danger than a 21 year old and have one beer and drive? Or even a person who just took a prescribed pill of some sort or a 40 year old who's losing his vision and forgets to wear his glasses?


Maybe you misunderstood me. My point was, given that having 1/2 a Keystone Light is illegal for a 19 year old period, why should it be any different when they choose to drive afterwards? Nothing beyond that -- which you seemed to infer.

And, just to add to the conversation, an argument can be made that 19 year olds in general are higher risks on the road than 21 year olds, 40 year olds, etc., which would, in turn, make them even more dangerous behind the wheel 'intoxicated'.

Again, I'm not interjecting myself into the conversation here. I've found these threads in GT to be a monumental waste of time, and I avoid getting involved in them at all costs. I was just questioning your semantecs, I guess, and asking for an explanation on what I deemed to be unclear.
Image
bigh0rt
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterGraphics ExpertMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeInnovative MemberCafe MusketeerWeb SupporterPick 3 Weekly Winner
Posts: 24818
(Past Year: 348)
Joined: 3 Jun 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Crowding The Plate

Postby Madison » Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:43 pm

Field wrote:
bigh0rt wrote:
Field wrote:So pretty much if you're 19 and you have a 1/2 of a keystone light you are breaking the law which is pretty absurd


Remind me why it's absurd, again? Underage drinking (which is illegal) and driving should be anything other than zero tolerance? :-?


Did you really just pull out the zero tolerance card on this one? I mean no one has pulled out the if you can go to war in Iraq and die for your country but you still can't drink a legal beer one yet.


I actually agree that if you're old enough to go to war defending our country, a cold beer shouldn't be illegal for that person to drink.

However, not all people between the ages of 18-20 are as responsible as the 18 year old soldier, so there's a zero tolerance policy that I happen to agree with.

Stinks for the 18 year old kid who's fighting for our freedom, but it's also something that kid most likely understands.

Coppermine wrote:If we only lived in a society where parents assumed the responsibility of teaching their children the importance of responsibility while consuming alcohol, our society would be much better off.

Too bad America is way to irresponsible as a whole to adhere to such a simple concept.


Agreed. Agreed. Agreed. ;-D ;-D
Yes doctor, I am sick.
Sick of those who are spineless.
Sick of those who feel self-entitled.
Sick of those who are hypocrites.
Yes doctor, an army is forming.
Yes doctor, there will be a war.
Yes doctor, there will be blood.....
Madison
Mod in Retirement
Mod in Retirement

User avatar
ExecutiveEditorCafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe WriterCafe RankerMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeCafe SpotterInnovative MemberCafe MusketeerPick 3 ChampionMatchup Meltdown SurvivorLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 53856
(Past Year: 1)
Joined: 29 Apr 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Taking Souls...

Postby Field » Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:54 pm

bigh0rt wrote:
Field wrote:
bigh0rt wrote:
Field wrote:So pretty much if you're 19 and you have a 1/2 of a keystone light you are breaking the law which is pretty absurd


Remind me why it's absurd, again? Underage drinking (which is illegal) and driving should be anything other than zero tolerance? :-?


Did you really just pull out the zero tolerance card on this one? I mean no one has pulled out the if you can go to war in Iraq and die for your country but you still can't drink a legal beer one yet.

If you are 19 and have one beer and drive are you more of a danger than a 21 year old and have one beer and drive? Or even a person who just took a prescribed pill of some sort or a 40 year old who's losing his vision and forgets to wear his glasses?


Maybe you misunderstood me. My point was, given that having 1/2 a Keystone Light is illegal for a 19 year old period, why should it be any different when they choose to drive afterwards? Nothing beyond that -- which you seemed to infer.

And, just to add to the conversation, an argument can be made that 19 year olds in general are higher risks on the road than 21 year olds, 40 year olds, etc., which would, in turn, make them even more dangerous behind the wheel 'intoxicated'.

Again, I'm not interjecting myself into the conversation here. I've found these threads in GT to be a monumental waste of time, and I avoid getting involved in them at all costs. I was just questioning your semantecs, I guess, and asking for an explanation on what I deemed to be unclear.


Yeah I get your point. I just don't quite understand why they give a DUI to a person under 21 if they blow a .03. I can see giving them a ticket for underage drinking, that would seem fair. But not a DUI which they will carry around for the rest of their lives. There is zero tolerance and their is fairness. How can a DUI be over .08 and under a .08 just because of age. They need to classify these two things as something totally differnt and they can't be given the same weight in my opinion.
Field
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
Fantasy Expert
Posts: 2549
Joined: 4 Nov 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: NH

Postby Coppermine » Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:06 pm

Well society, and the long arm of the law, says "if you let your kids drink under 21, you're all breaking the law." How is that setting America's future up for responsible drinking habits. Now, i know there are some very religious people out there who can you use the built-in guilt factor of Christianity to sway their children from drinking. I work with a guy, 26 years old, who actually believes that when Jesus turned water into wine in the Bible, he was "really" turning it into grape juice, because no one drank back then.

Too bad historical texts prove that drinking alcohol was the only safe means of consuming water and that it was only the rich aristrocratic who were afforded the luxury of wine; such the great miracle of turning potentially harmful water into life-giving wine.

Then again, I suppose if you're suppressingly religious, historical texts are nothing but silly heresay anyway.

I think I got my point across though; instead of demonizing alcohol as a worldly evil "unitl you're 21!" we should be starting off as responsible drinkers. Alcohol is a part of our society. Any intellectual who refuses to drink at a cocktail party is going to get snickered at, your personal villifications not withstanding. Just take some responsibility for yourself, it's that simple. Living in rural America, it's unbelievable how dumb people generally are. And if you, as an indifiividual, choose not to drink... then more power to you! If we had a responsible approach to alcohol, drinkers and non-drinkers alike would be able to live happily... only the drinkers of course would have more fun :-b
If you're a battery, you're either working or you're dead....
Coppermine
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar

Posts: 8840
Joined: 6 Sep 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Pennsyltucky

Postby The_Met_Threat » Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:58 pm

Copper, not that i dont agree that saying "no alcohol till your 21" is wrong, its just that kids under 21 already have a reasonable understanding of its effects. Im not saying every person under 21 years old drinks or get drunk, but giving them a beer or two at the dinner table really wouldn't help anything in my mind. It would probably actually give them more reason to "get wasted" since they will say, my parents don't care if i get wasted. Just my .02 cents.
Image
The Mets [b]will[/b] win the World Series this year.
The_Met_Threat
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar

Posts: 2210
Joined: 14 May 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby Coppermine » Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:02 pm

The_Met_Threat wrote:Copper, not that i dont agree that saying "no alcohol till your 21" is wrong, its just that kids under 21 already have a reasonable understanding of its effects. Im not saying every person under 21 years old drinks or get drunk, but giving them a beer or two at the dinner table really wouldn't help anything in my mind. It would probably actually give them more reason to "get wasted" since they will say, my parents don't care if i get wasted. Just my .02 cents.


See, no, I don't think that kids (not kids, these are young adults here) already have a reasonable understanding of its effects. If they have not drank, they either think A.) That alcohol is the most horrible thing in the world that will kill them if they smell it, or, B.) The most awesome thing ever that is necessary to meet chicks, get laid and have fun. One is from schools/the government, the other is from advertising. If anything, i think it confuses people. You're talking as if you had the opportunity to try alcohol before you were 21, and if so, you were probably better off for it. My point is that those who are not exposed to it until they are 21 and independent and more likely to make bad choices.
If you're a battery, you're either working or you're dead....
Coppermine
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar

Posts: 8840
Joined: 6 Sep 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Pennsyltucky

Postby The_Met_Threat » Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:05 pm

Coppermine wrote:
The_Met_Threat wrote:Copper, not that i dont agree that saying "no alcohol till your 21" is wrong, its just that kids under 21 already have a reasonable understanding of its effects. Im not saying every person under 21 years old drinks or get drunk, but giving them a beer or two at the dinner table really wouldn't help anything in my mind. It would probably actually give them more reason to "get wasted" since they will say, my parents don't care if i get wasted. Just my .02 cents.


See, no, I don't think that kids (not kids, these are young adults here) already have a reasonable understanding of its effects. If they have not drank, they either think A.) That alcohol is the most horrible thing in the world that will kill them if they smell it, or, B.) The most awesome thing ever that is necessary to meet chicks, get laid and have fun. One is from schools/the government, the other is from advertising. If anything, i think it confuses people. You're talking as if you had the opportunity to try alcohol before you were 21, and if so, you were probably better off for it. My point is that those who are not exposed to it until they are 21 and independent and more likely to make bad choices.


Well i am under 21, and i guess im just taking a small sample size, but practically everyone i know my age drinks or has before. But im sure if we looked up the percentages id probably be wrong and only like 30% of people under 21 has had alcohol, or something like that. So without knowing the statistics, ill retract my statement.
Image
The Mets [b]will[/b] win the World Series this year.
The_Met_Threat
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar

Posts: 2210
Joined: 14 May 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby Coppermine » Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:13 pm

The_Met_Threat wrote:
Coppermine wrote:
The_Met_Threat wrote:Copper, not that i dont agree that saying "no alcohol till your 21" is wrong, its just that kids under 21 already have a reasonable understanding of its effects. Im not saying every person under 21 years old drinks or get drunk, but giving them a beer or two at the dinner table really wouldn't help anything in my mind. It would probably actually give them more reason to "get wasted" since they will say, my parents don't care if i get wasted. Just my .02 cents.


See, no, I don't think that kids (not kids, these are young adults here) already have a reasonable understanding of its effects. If they have not drank, they either think A.) That alcohol is the most horrible thing in the world that will kill them if they smell it, or, B.) The most awesome thing ever that is necessary to meet chicks, get laid and have fun. One is from schools/the government, the other is from advertising. If anything, i think it confuses people. You're talking as if you had the opportunity to try alcohol before you were 21, and if so, you were probably better off for it. My point is that those who are not exposed to it until they are 21 and independent and more likely to make bad choices.


Well i am under 21, and i guess im just taking a small sample size, but practically everyone i know my age drinks or has before. But im sure if we looked up the percentages id probably be wrong and only like 30% of people under 21 has had alcohol, or something like that.


I would agree with that; I had drank before I was 21, both with my parents (although it was like drinking in a nazi prison camp) and with friends at parties. What I noticed in college though was the students who were problem drinkers were those who had not drank in high school... the ones from very religious families who equated it with hell in a bottle (now, my sample is small too, I'm from a rural, conservative portion of south central Pennsylvania, yet my parents are from Queens so I have a fresh perspective) were the ones who ended up drinking themselves to stupidity, or wanted to drive trashed or the ones who skipped classes from being hung over on a Tuesday morning. It was my own observations that fuel my stereotypical view of bad drinking behavior; religious students from religious families who demonize alcohol are the one's most likely to abuse it.

On the flip side, there were plenty of religious conservative students who wouldn't touch it, but they would never go out to parties either. But by Junior year, you're around the people who like to go out, have a good time, party hard on the weekends because they're responsible students during the week.

And to be honest, the same holds true with marijuana use.
If you're a battery, you're either working or you're dead....
Coppermine
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar

Posts: 8840
Joined: 6 Sep 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Pennsyltucky

Postby Omaha Red Sox » Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:34 pm

I drank a whole heckuva lot more before I turned 21 than after. X-I

I also never had one hangover till I turned 21. :-{
Omaha Red Sox
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterCafe RankerMock(ing) DrafterEagle Eye
Posts: 11421
(Past Year: 7)
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Home Cafe: Football
Location: Probably over there

Previous

Return to General Talk

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Forums Articles & Tips Sleepers Rankings Leagues


  • Fantasy Baseball
  • Article Submissions
  • Privacy Statement
  • Site Survey 
  • Contact