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Is Hamels Even Worth It...?

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Postby RynMan » Wed Jun 28, 2006 6:39 pm

PlayingWithFire wrote:
RynMan wrote:Wow, let the whipping begin.

Let's not forget that this guy might have been the top pitching prospect in the minors 2 months ago. Dropping him for guys like Reyes, Miner, Lester, in my opinion is a rash move. The walk rate is a little high and out of line with his minor league numbers so it's fair to say that should eventually regress. In addition, the offenses that he have faced haven't been a bunch of stiffs.

Anything less than a 12 team league I am fine cutting bait with him (in a redraft). Other than that I think you have to be patient.


that might be true, but it was hardly a huge margin. Guys like Billingsley, Sowers, Lester weren't doing all that bad in AAA either. And the talent level weren't extremely considering guys like Liriano, Cain are already in the majors. Philip Hughes might be the best SP prospect in the minors right now, but that's really not saying much considering the depth of SP in the minors now. Nobody ever denies that Hamels has talent, but there's this big question mark with his health. I don't see anything wrong with dropping him for Lester(lesser prospect, healthier, better team) and dropping him in a 12 teams redraft. If you are in a keeper or dynasty, the time to sell him has passed and it would be foolish to drop him or to sell him for next to nothing right now, might as well keep him.


I'd rather take the guy that gets to face the pitcher every 2nd or 3rd inning as opposed the guy who gets to pitch in the AL East.
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Postby PlayingWithFire » Wed Jun 28, 2006 6:41 pm

RynMan wrote:
PlayingWithFire wrote:
RynMan wrote:Wow, let the whipping begin.

Let's not forget that this guy might have been the top pitching prospect in the minors 2 months ago. Dropping him for guys like Reyes, Miner, Lester, in my opinion is a rash move. The walk rate is a little high and out of line with his minor league numbers so it's fair to say that should eventually regress. In addition, the offenses that he have faced haven't been a bunch of stiffs.

Anything less than a 12 team league I am fine cutting bait with him (in a redraft). Other than that I think you have to be patient.


that might be true, but it was hardly a huge margin. Guys like Billingsley, Sowers, Lester weren't doing all that bad in AAA either. And the talent level weren't extremely considering guys like Liriano, Cain are already in the majors. Philip Hughes might be the best SP prospect in the minors right now, but that's really not saying much considering the depth of SP in the minors now. Nobody ever denies that Hamels has talent, but there's this big question mark with his health. I don't see anything wrong with dropping him for Lester(lesser prospect, healthier, better team) and dropping him in a 12 teams redraft. If you are in a keeper or dynasty, the time to sell him has passed and it would be foolish to drop him or to sell him for next to nothing right now, might as well keep him.


I'd rather take the guy that gets to face the pitcher every 2nd or 3rd inning as opposed the guy who gets to pitch in the AL East.


I'll take my healthy guy playing in AL East rather than somebody that's going to spend a tons of time on the DL playing half his game in that launching pad known as Citizen Bank Park.
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Postby acsguitar » Wed Jun 28, 2006 6:46 pm

If he could just learn to put away batters with two strikes you will see a very very good pitcher. He gets ahead and then blows it
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Postby RynMan » Wed Jun 28, 2006 7:06 pm

PlayingWithFire wrote:I'll take my healthy guy playing in AL East rather than somebody that's going to spend a tons of time on the DL playing half his game in that launching pad known as Citizen Bank Park.


Brett Myers seems to handle it alright, as you do when you can prevent balls from being put into play.

I think you are overstating his history of injuries. It's been discussed in here at length how the injuries he have suffered haven't been exclusively pitching or baseball related.

With such a violent action consisting of repetition and fatigue, every pitcher is an injury risk. Another reason why you don't overpay for starting pitching in fantasy.
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Postby PlayingWithFire » Wed Jun 28, 2006 7:15 pm

RynMan wrote:
PlayingWithFire wrote:I'll take my healthy guy playing in AL East rather than somebody that's going to spend a tons of time on the DL playing half his game in that launching pad known as Citizen Bank Park.


Brett Myers seems to handle it alright, as you do when you can prevent balls from being put into play.

I think you are overstating his history of injuries. It's been discussed in here at length how the injuries he have suffered haven't been exclusively pitching or baseball related.

With such a violent action consisting of repetition and fatigue, every pitcher is an injury risk. Another reason why you don't overpay for starting pitching in fantasy.


Mark Prior's injuries lately has been of freak variety too, that doesn't take away the injury-prone label though.

and oh, Curt Schilling is doing okay too in Boston.
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Postby RynMan » Wed Jun 28, 2006 7:20 pm

PlayingWithFire wrote:Mark Prior's injuries lately has been of freak variety too, that doesn't take away the injury-prone label though.


It should. It's not hard for people to dig a little deeper and use some lateral thinking.

PlayingWithFire wrote:and oh, Curt Schilling is doing okay too in Boston.


So is Josh Beckett. :-D
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Postby Hobbes » Wed Jun 28, 2006 7:56 pm

I hear comments all the time about holding on to a struggling player if you are in a keeper league, but I think those comments are way too broad.

I'm in a keeper league, but we only keep 5 players. A rookie would have to do pretty well to make it onto a shallow keeper list. I have Liriano on my team, and he is likely to make it, but Hamels would have had to perform like Liriano for me to have faith he would develop into a keeper by the end of this season. Perhaps in leagues with many more keepers you could keep the faith, but it would certainly vary based on the number of keepers.

So to say owners in keeper leagues should be patient is too general. I've got a shallow bench and can't afford to just wait around on Hamels to work through his problems. To the waiver wire he goes.
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Postby NIU Ricky » Wed Jun 28, 2006 10:42 pm

I'm holding onto him for his next 2 starts at least, if he does bad then he'll get the heave-ho! His injury may still be bothering him and I'm already at 45 moves in a 75 move-max league, so I must be patient
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Postby jdsun1 » Wed Jun 28, 2006 10:59 pm

As hyped as he was he is still worth holding onto a bit longer.
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Postby v1rtuoso » Thu Jun 29, 2006 1:12 am

Phillies as a team haven't exactly been playing well either...
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