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U.S. soldiers' bodies mutilated, booby-trapped

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Postby Fireball Express » Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:45 am

wrveres wrote:
Fireball Express wrote:The point most of you guys are missing is that what happened to these soldiers, the torture and brutal murder was carried out personally by the new leader of A-Q in Iraq as a sign that he is brutal beast. He'll be lucky if he meets the same fate as AZ. Bombing is too humane for this guy. A nice drag downtown would be what he deserves.


Fireball ... people like AA could give a rats arse about the dead American soldier lying booby trapped in a ditch. It defeats his purpose.
Now if a Democrat sent them into battle, he would think differently ..

Its disgusting actually, but you need to understand where he is coming from


Yes, his hatred for anyone with conservative values is overly evident by just looking at his sig.
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Postby wrveres » Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:45 am

Coppermine wrote:
wrveres wrote:
Absolutely Adequate wrote:http://www.channel3000.com/news/9404255/detail.html
http://www.antiwar.com/news/?articleid=2444 (warning: disturbing photos)


I could go on, veres, but it won't matter to you. You'll ignore anything that conflicts with your worldview.

But the administration claims that prisoners taken in Afghanistan are not prisoners of war (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Ghraib ... tional_law)
because they want to torture them for information. That information is highly suspect, though, as every expert agrees that information given under the penalty of torture is wildly unreliable.

Maybe we just disagree with what torture is. I agree with the U.N.


Any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him... information or a confession, punishing him for an act he... has committed or is suspected of having committed, or intimidating or coercing him.


Given that definition, you're just arguing intensity of torture, which you'll notice I predicted you'd do. But maybe you're using a different definition. Maybe this one:

Anyone I agree with is automatically right and I never have to consider anyone else's opinion regarding torture. Also, the Earth is flat.


Okay apparently you missed the headline ..

7 Marines, 1 Sailor Charged With Murder.
Now I might not be the smartest bear in the woods, but that seems to me that this activity was not condoned!

you seem to think it was.. how narrow minded of you


I thought about bringing this up since this has been in the news a lot lately, but decided against it for that very reason; they haven't been found guilty of anything, yet the accusations aren't very promising. If this is true, it's an unfortunate incident, and hopefully more isolated than most. In any case, even if it were true, you can't hold the US military accountable for the misguided actions of a few.


oh AA can ..
He probably wil blame Barbara Bush for their actions ..
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Postby Coppermine » Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:48 am

Barbara Bush can be pretty persuasive, with her stunning good [b]looks[\b] and impeccable charm :-D
Last edited by Coppermine on Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby wrveres » Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:49 am

Coppermine wrote:Barbara Bush can be pretty persuasive, with her stunning good lucks and impeccable charm :-D


lol :-D
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Postby Madison » Thu Jun 22, 2006 12:01 pm

Let's make sure to play nice in here guys. :-)
Yes doctor, I am sick.
Sick of those who are spineless.
Sick of those who feel self-entitled.
Sick of those who are hypocrites.
Yes doctor, an army is forming.
Yes doctor, there will be a war.
Yes doctor, there will be blood.....
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Postby wrveres » Thu Jun 22, 2006 12:02 pm

Fireball Express wrote:
wrveres wrote:
Fireball Express wrote:The point most of you guys are missing is that what happened to these soldiers, the torture and brutal murder was carried out personally by the new leader of A-Q in Iraq as a sign that he is brutal beast. He'll be lucky if he meets the same fate as AZ. Bombing is too humane for this guy. A nice drag downtown would be what he deserves.


Fireball ... people like AA could give a rats arse about the dead American soldier lying booby trapped in a ditch. It defeats his purpose.
Now if a Democrat sent them into battle, he would think differently ..

Its disgusting actually, but you need to understand where he is coming from


Yes, his hatred for anyone with conservative values is overly evident by just looking at his sig.


Just to give everybody an idea of what that little operation elephant thing that AA so proudly sports in a fantasy baseball forum

Image

Not only that, it rambles on about how Republicans "Hunt Brown People" .. It has to be one of the more disgusting sites I have ever seen, I can't believe the cafe lets him use that as a sig. But yet he is sooo proud of it ..

it is sickening it what it is ..
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Postby davidmarver » Thu Jun 22, 2006 12:41 pm

Art Vandelay wrote:
davidmarver wrote:To anyone who doesn't think this operation is "worth it", I would love to take you back in time, place you in Baghdad five years ago under Saddam's rule, and note your change in viewpoint.

Why stop at five years ago? Go back 20 years, before sanctions, before Saddam nationalized the Iraqi oil fields, when Iraq was among the world leaders in literacy rate, and had some of the best health care and institutions of higher learning in the world.

If this war leads to a free and stable Iraq then I think it will be worth it. However, I severely doubt that that will happen. What it will probably lead to is at least five more years of what we're seeing currently, then a situation like we saw in the Balkans.

It won't happen if there is a shift in power in Congress or the White House. However, I'm sure if the United States keeps our operation going full fledged -- in other words, as it is now -- that the nation will become stable, self-governing, and free within a decade. The future of the Iraqis is really up for the vote in the next election; if the Democrats win it pretty much guarantees a half-arsed job in Iraq and a subsequent withdrawal. I'm not too old, but I think (on the world scale) the 2008 election will be the most pivitol of my life time thus far.

AA wrote:1. We have tortured them. That does not excuse what they did - of course not. But when I look at the situation in Ireland, for instance, each side claims the other started it. Neither has the moral authority to be considered the side I'd want to join because both factions are doing terrible things. We are in that same boat.

So sitting on our thumbs while 27,800,000 Iraqis suffer and starve under tyrannical rule would show more moral authority? Wouldn't that show a reluctance to act on our moral values and, for that matter, a lack of authority?

I'm really not sure what you want in the world AA. There's really no way around the atrocities committed in the world daily. There has to be a starting point somewhere. As much as you'd like to run away ;-) from the problems in the world, you can't do that and simultaneously claim that neither side has "moral authority". It's the chickens that lack the morals to use their authority that have allowed these human right crimes and torture to exist for the past few decades.

You can't leave Earth.
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Postby Omaha Red Sox » Thu Jun 22, 2006 12:52 pm

davidmarver wrote:
AA wrote:1. We have tortured them. That does not excuse what they did - of course not. But when I look at the situation in Ireland, for instance, each side claims the other started it. Neither has the moral authority to be considered the side I'd want to join because both factions are doing terrible things. We are in that same boat.

So sitting on our thumbs while 27,800,000 Iraqis suffer and starve under tyrannical rule would show more moral authority? Wouldn't that show a reluctance to act on our moral values and, for that matter, a lack of authority?

I'm really not sure what you want in the world AA. There's really no way around the atrocities committed in the world daily. There has to be a starting point somewhere. As much as you'd like to run away ;-) from the problems in the world, you can't do that and simultaneously claim that neither side has "moral authority". It's the chickens that lack the morals to use their authority that have allowed these human right crimes and torture to exist for the past few decades.

You can't leave Earth.


This is a great post david. Probably one of my favorites. I think I'm going to print this out, frame it and put it in my office. Awesome.
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Postby Coppermine » Thu Jun 22, 2006 1:06 pm

Omaha Red Sox wrote:
davidmarver wrote:
AA wrote:1. We have tortured them. That does not excuse what they did - of course not. But when I look at the situation in Ireland, for instance, each side claims the other started it. Neither has the moral authority to be considered the side I'd want to join because both factions are doing terrible things. We are in that same boat.

So sitting on our thumbs while 27,800,000 Iraqis suffer and starve under tyrannical rule would show more moral authority? Wouldn't that show a reluctance to act on our moral values and, for that matter, a lack of authority?

I'm really not sure what you want in the world AA. There's really no way around the atrocities committed in the world daily. There has to be a starting point somewhere. As much as you'd like to run away ;-) from the problems in the world, you can't do that and simultaneously claim that neither side has "moral authority". It's the chickens that lack the morals to use their authority that have allowed these human right crimes and torture to exist for the past few decades.

You can't leave Earth.


This is a great post david. Probably one of my favorites. I think I'm going to print this out, frame it and put it in my office. Awesome.


That is an excellent point and I agree, but is Iraq really the starting point, or the end? Do you know how many countries have citizens, millions, in some cases billions, of citizens starving and dying under tyrannical rule.

Once we're done with Iraq, does that mean that we must also invade North Korea, Sudan, Sierra Leone, Haiti, Cuba, Angola, Tajikstan, Albania, Iran, Ethiopia, Rwanda, Cote d'Ivory and the Congo? How about huge countries with human rights violations like China and Pakistan? Singapore? India is a damn democracy with millions of people dying each year. Bangladesh? Myanmar? Meanwhile, millions die of AIDS in Africa and global poverty is the single most destructive force on the planet.

I'm just trying to keep this in a global perspective and using the excuse of "we're helping them" is a sad one for invading Iraq in my opinion. The world is a tough place. Again, there's more than two sides to every situation.
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Postby 5 » Thu Jun 22, 2006 1:36 pm

The moral to the story...the son should've honored thy father.

Unfortunately we're seeing why Pa Bush thought it was bad move to go into Iraq.
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