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Might wanna take a good hard look at Foulke.

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Postby josebach » Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:51 pm

Dice wrote:There is another option here folks.

If both Foulke and Papelbon continue to pitch well, and if Hansen is ready to come up this year to join the bullpen, couldn't the Red Sox deal Foulke to a contending team that needs a closer for a starting pitcher to fill that hole? That wouldn't be even half as shocking as the original Nomar trade was.

That's why this situation is so interesting. The Sox have options, needs, and flexibility, with short term and long term ramifications. And Epstein is very creative and not afraid to do things differently.

BTW, I have to revise my earlier statement that Foulke was the third best reliever on the Red Sox at the moment. After looking at the stats more it's clear that he's pitching much better than Timlin. His WHIP is half of Timlin's, and the K/BB ratio is 10:2 rather than Timlin's 4:4. Timlin's ERA is lower at the moment, but he's been letting inherited runners score at will for two years now, and Foulke has had a few bad breaks like Peña fumbling a ball for a HR.


The problem there is that nobody is going to pay even close to full cost for Foulke because he's simply not healthy. He's complaining about his knees again which means he could be one bad inning away from being DL bound again. I think this in addition to Paps doing so well is what's going to solidify Paps job as the closer.
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Postby thomasps3 » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:02 pm

The Synvisc that he is being shot up with is nothing to concern yourselves with. Last year RJ had that shot 13 times. The key thing to look at for Foulke is the diffeential between his fastball(87-90) and change(78-80). Those differentials are crucial. Additionally, if you look at the number of bad luck pitches(Glaus walk on strike 3, Wily Mo's blunder), Foulke would have a high 2 era and excellent whip. Coming from a pretty serious fan who has seen every game this year, Foulke started out shaky and has now throwing as well as he was in 2004. This to me is time to pick him up off the wire if he is there, or deal for him from some other Gm who may not have the pertinent info at his fingertips.

This is the classic buy low candidate.
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Postby Krunk City King$ » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:06 pm

thomasps3 wrote:The Synvisc that he is being shot up with is nothing to concern yourselves with. Last year RJ had that shot 13 times. The key thing to look at for Foulke is the diffeential between his fastball(87-90) and change(78-80). Those differentials are crucial. Additionally, if you look at the number of bad luck pitches(Glaus walk on strike 3, Wily Mo's blunder), Foulke would have a high 2 era and excellent whip. Coming from a pretty serious fan who has seen every game this year, Foulke started out shaky and has now throwing as well as he was in 2004. This to me is time to pick him up off the wire if he is there, or deal for him from some other Gm who may not have the pertinent info at his fingertips.

This is the classic buy low candidate.


Would you really trust a fool's gold closer like that in your lineup?

Do you have an "I missed out on Paps" T-shirt on under your oxford button up?
Last edited by Krunk City King$ on Tue Apr 25, 2006 5:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Yoda » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:17 pm

thomasps3 wrote:The Synvisc that he is being shot up with is nothing to concern yourselves with. Last year RJ had that shot 13 times. The key thing to look at for Foulke is the diffeential between his fastball(87-90) and change(78-80). Those differentials are crucial. Additionally, if you look at the number of bad luck pitches(Glaus walk on strike 3, Wily Mo's blunder), Foulke would have a high 2 era and excellent whip. Coming from a pretty serious fan who has seen every game this year, Foulke started out shaky and has now throwing as well as he was in 2004. This to me is time to pick him up off the wire if he is there, or deal for him from some other Gm who may not have the pertinent info at his fingertips.

This is the classic buy low candidate.


This sounds pretty right. I've also been watching him since the beginning of the season and he looks nothing like he did in 04. If he continues to pitch well, he has a real shot at getting his job back.
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Foulke...setup man at best

Postby DaleMurphy » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:23 pm

I live in Boston and all you hear on the radio and news is Foulke and Paplebon. Don't count on Foulke to be the closer anytime soon:

#1 Foulke has continued to complain about his knees over the past weeks. The injections are the same ones that Wells had that did not take and Foulke needed two shots before they did.

#2 the Sox would like to have 3 decent relievers in the bullpen. Right now they are Foulke, Timlin and Papelbon. Foulke has expressed time and time again that he never wanted to be a closer and he could flourish in a setup role.

#3 The Sox would be willing to plug and play with the 5th starter spot until clemens decides if he would be willing to come to Boston or until they see if Lester might be ready for a summer call up.

#4 Sox are afraid to convert Papelbon back to a starter...He could get hurt trying to do it too quickly....and if Foulke didn't work out, could he again convert back to closer.

#5 Hansen needs to develope a slider...thats why he is in the minors...he has a magor league fastball but that's not enough...they will not rush him.

#6 the Sox are not playing for this year...they are playing for the future and they will not jeopordize any young talent. See Arroyo...why would they trade away a decent young pitcher when: Schillings health was uncertain to strat the season, as was Foulkes, Wells was older, Clemente was never the same after the beaning last year, there were questions about Beckett handling the pressure of Boston. Arroyo looks pretty good right now. But why did Boston trade Arroyo-they wanted Pena for the future...Nixon will be gone next year and he is a future power hitting project.

The Sox will not jepordize Paplebon, Hanson or Lester.

Foulke, IMO, will be a decent setup man...nothing more.
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Postby thedukeorsino » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:28 pm

Paplebon is secure in the closer role for at least the first half. Plan A for the sox is obviously filling the gap in the rotation with spot guys until Wells comes back healthy. If Wells doesn't come back effectively, then plan B would probably be a trade for a starter, the off chance of signing Clemens, etc.

Pap going back to the rotation has nothing to do with Foulke's performance, or even his future destiny as a starter, it has to do with the red sox season. Paplebon is the closer now- period. Only if something goes terribly wrong- like losing another starter, or really not being able to fill the #5 slot- would they be FORCED to use him.

Francona is a big fan of not messing with success, something that was a big relief over Grady Little. He won't be touching Pap for quite some time.
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Re: Foulke...setup man at best

Postby Yoda » Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:36 pm

DaleMurphy wrote:I live in Boston and all you hear on the radio and news is Foulke and Paplebon. Don't count on Foulke to be the closer anytime soon:

#1 Foulke has continued to complain about his knees over the past weeks. The injections are the same ones that Wells had that did not take and Foulke needed two shots before they did.

#2 the Sox would like to have 3 decent relievers in the bullpen. Right now they are Foulke, Timlin and Papelbon. Foulke has expressed time and time again that he never wanted to be a closer and he could flourish in a setup role.

#3 The Sox would be willing to plug and play with the 5th starter spot until clemens decides if he would be willing to come to Boston or until they see if Lester might be ready for a summer call up.

#4 Sox are afraid to convert Papelbon back to a starter...He could get hurt trying to do it too quickly....and if Foulke didn't work out, could he again convert back to closer.

#5 Hansen needs to develope a slider...thats why he is in the minors...he has a magor league fastball but that's not enough...they will not rush him.

#6 the Sox are not playing for this year...they are playing for the future and they will not jeopordize any young talent. See Arroyo...why would they trade away a decent young pitcher when: Schillings health was uncertain to strat the season, as was Foulkes, Wells was older, Clemente was never the same after the beaning last year, there were questions about Beckett handling the pressure of Boston. Arroyo looks pretty good right now. But why did Boston trade Arroyo-they wanted Pena for the future...Nixon will be gone next year and he is a future power hitting project.

The Sox will not jepordize Paplebon, Hanson or Lester.

Foulke, IMO, will be a decent setup man...nothing more.


A few observations. It doesn't really matter what Foulke wants. Sox will do whatever is necessary to help the team win.

Hansen is in the minors developing a change up not a slider.

Clement wasn't beaned. He was hit in the head with a line drive.

Sox are absolutely playing for this year. I'm not sure why you would think otherwise. They traded Arroyo because they had the pitching depth and there were speculations taht he couldn't handle pressure and pitch in Boston.

Beckett can handle pressure just fine. He is a big time pitcher at only 26 years old. The questions is will he be healthy for once?

Lester is not ready. He's getting rocked in the minors right now and there is no way they will bring him up at this point.
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