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Edmonds - why not valued higher?

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Postby jealousblues » Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:42 am

mak1277 wrote:
johnsamo wrote:still good but his #s declinging over the last few years... That and his on the field heroics make him more of an injury risk.


You mean his on the field histrionics don't you? So many of his magnificent diving catches are a direct result of him dogging it just so he can dive. Then he comes up like he hurt himself. He's just a hot dog. It's a shame too, because he really is a superb defensive player.


Thats BS, but ok.
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Postby George_Foreman » Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:48 am

mak1277 wrote:
johnsamo wrote:still good but his #s declinging over the last few years... That and his on the field heroics make him more of an injury risk.


You mean his on the field histrionics don't you? So many of his magnificent diving catches are a direct result of him dogging it just so he can dive. Then he comes up like he hurt himself. He's just a hot dog. It's a shame too, because he really is a superb defensive player.
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Postby Splendid61 » Mon Apr 24, 2006 3:38 pm

If you think about it, how many guys who have a flaw? (Can't hit lefties, whatever the case may be) where you sit him and start him according to his flaws, but you end up missing stats? Is that any different than "missing stats" because edmunds takes off?

It's very different.

When you sit a player because he can't hit lefties, you generally start one of your bench players in his place. When Edmonds takes a day off at random, you can't start anyone in his place, so you end up with zeros.




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Postby Smee » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:05 pm

George_Foreman wrote:Jim Edmonds is underrated.


Good read, I've never seen the Keltner test before. ;-D
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Postby chadlincoln » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:27 pm

j24jags wrote:At this point, he is on the decline and he is injury prone.
Injuries and days rest.
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Postby seancasey21 » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:28 pm

jealousblues wrote:
mak1277 wrote:
johnsamo wrote:still good but his #s declinging over the last few years... That and his on the field heroics make him more of an injury risk.


You mean his on the field histrionics don't you? So many of his magnificent diving catches are a direct result of him dogging it just so he can dive. Then he comes up like he hurt himself. He's just a hot dog. It's a shame too, because he really is a superb defensive player.


Thats BS, but ok.


BS? Have you ever watched him on a consistent basis? I have several avid Cardinal fans as friends who would say the above description of Edmonds antics is almost spot on. He's not "just" a hot dog but a hot dog nonetheless in the batter's box and in the field
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Postby NikkiSixx » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:44 pm

I personally think Edmonds' age is going to catch up with him this year, I could be wrong though.
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Postby RAmst23 » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:53 pm

seancasey21 wrote:
jealousblues wrote:
mak1277 wrote:
johnsamo wrote:still good but his #s declinging over the last few years... That and his on the field heroics make him more of an injury risk.


You mean his on the field histrionics don't you? So many of his magnificent diving catches are a direct result of him dogging it just so he can dive. Then he comes up like he hurt himself. He's just a hot dog. It's a shame too, because he really is a superb defensive player.


Thats BS, but ok.


BS? Have you ever watched him on a consistent basis? I have several avid Cardinal fans as friends who would say the above description of Edmonds antics is almost spot on. He's not "just" a hot dog but a hot dog nonetheless in the batter's box and in the field


Yea, this topic hasn't come up about 300 times before. Does Edmonds play to the crowd sometimes? Sure, he likes to be flashy. However, this doesn't take away from his overall defense. It's like tossing your bat after a home run. It doesn't mean you hit less home runs, it just means you like to add a little flash to your performance.

I've seen Edmonds tons of times and he's made some tremendous plays. The man made all of 2 errors last year and makes the plays in the outfield. Just because he likes to "hot dog" it doesn't mean he fails to make the play.
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Postby jealousblues » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:53 pm

seancasey21 wrote:
jealousblues wrote:
mak1277 wrote:
johnsamo wrote:still good but his #s declinging over the last few years... That and his on the field heroics make him more of an injury risk.


You mean his on the field histrionics don't you? So many of his magnificent diving catches are a direct result of him dogging it just so he can dive. Then he comes up like he hurt himself. He's just a hot dog. It's a shame too, because he really is a superb defensive player.


Thats BS, but ok.


BS? Have you ever watched him on a consistent basis? I have several avid Cardinal fans as friends who would say the above description of Edmonds antics is almost spot on. He's not "just" a hot dog but a hot dog nonetheless in the batter's box and in the field


yeah, I do watch him on a consistant basis. He plays shallow and isnt the fastest guy ever. But accusing a 35 year old, injury prone out fielder of diving for ESPN is rediculous. I mean come one, when David eckstien runs down a ball its hustle, when Jim does he is showboating. Now maybe he did early, but I just dont think he would do that now, its not prudant. I mean he made a huge diving catch in the NLCS two years ago...was he showboating then because he dove and had to make a hard catch...or simply playing to win?

How is he a hotdog in the Battersbox? The only thing i can think of is him diving out of the way or every inside pitch. I dont know if he is afraid of them or trying to get a call.
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Postby great gretzky » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:56 pm

"It's very different.

When you sit a player because he can't hit lefties, you generally start one of your bench players in his place. When Edmonds takes a day off at random, you can't start anyone in his place, so you end up with zeros.
"

Of course it is different, but I think to a large degree, it isn't fundamentally THAT different. You jsut mentally don't think of it that way. Say you sit blalock against lefties. Good policy right? Well, how many times did your fill-in get an 0fer? Probably a fair amount of time.

Well, I know blalock is an extreme case. BUT, most people draft their positions based upon the year's total production. So if you play the start and sit game too much with someone like blalock, you are shaving off 15 runs, 8 home runs, and 19 rbi. he becomes a 65 run, 17hr, 73 rbi player. Not too special. And think about this across the spectrum.

My point is that there are "lost" stats all over the place in fantasy baseball. And the practical effect is if Edmunds outproduces most other outfielders in 20 less games, what is the difference? You are just perceiving a lost opportunity, because it is more visible to you. But his yearly stats are still an advantage. It sucks that his days off are hard to predict, but there you go.

I'll take him.
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