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Bigger Crybabies - Cubs fans or Red Sox fans?

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Postby Dr.DooM » Sat Jun 28, 2003 3:37 pm

You know, I like rooting for the underdog. Most of us don't root for the Yankees, but nowadays, I find it harder to root for the Red Sox either. It's not just the fans, but the way they want to portray themselves as the "good guys" while the Yankees represent the "Evil Empire."

Take yesterdays game against the Marlins for example. After pounding them for 14 runs in the first inning, they don't show any class whatsoever. Anyone notice Ortiz rubbing it in by showboating his homer in the second inning? What about sending Walker on a short flyball...when the score was 21-5. The guy belted a line-drive into Olson's head (sending him to the hospital) and all they could think about was running up the score. It was absolutely merciless. How do you root for a team like this? How do you sympathize with the BoSox nation? If the Yankess are the "Evil Empire," then the BoSox are the Tuskan Raiders. They're scruffy, a little funny looking, and not at all endearing.
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Postby Nomar4prez » Sat Jun 28, 2003 4:05 pm

Did you watch the game yesterday?

After the pitcher was hit, you could see that EVERYONE on the Red Sox was worried about him. What do you want the Red Sox to do? Stop scoring? They don't have many offensive subs, although they did sub in three guys. These guys are paid to score runs, not to be nice and gentleman-like to the other team. BTW, that wasn't great hitting by the Sox, it was horrendous pitching and fielding by the marlins.
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Postby Dr.DooM » Sat Jun 28, 2003 4:38 pm

I will give Boston credit for their concern over Olsen. In this respect, they are better than Eagles fans in Philly. But let's be honest, the Marlins were massacred and the Red Sox rollicked in their entrails. It felt like watching a big kid pounding the daylights out of a little girl. Is it a sin to win? No. Should they have shown some restraint? Yes.

I don't want to make the Red Sox look bad, I truly want them to beat the Yanks. But taking their frustrations out on expansion teams and Roger Clemens makes it harder to cheer them on.
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Postby DanteNoX » Sat Jun 28, 2003 4:52 pm

As a *true* Yankee fan, i would say that every fan is different. On an individual basis, the most annoying fan i know is a Mets fan, but that doesnt mean he covers all mets fans. These generalizations over fans go a bit far sometimes; afterall, all true fans are fans of the game. I respect anyone who goes out and vigorously supports their home team. Even if they are Boston fans.

PS: I was lying about the Boston fans. They are awefull fans, violent; always starting fights at Yanks-Sox games at Fenway. The organization has a history of racism, as with all other Boston teams (and unfortunately, historically with the fans as well). That black eye is large in my book. Not to say that all of baseball hasn't struggled with racism in the past century, but Boston had always been a bit more aggressively hatefull. The way they treated Clemens was a travesty. You don't disparage publicly the best pitcher your franchise has ever known. Clemens has no reason to like the Red Sox, and anyone who says he owes them loyalty or he should like them is confused about the facts. The Red Sox organization turned their backs on Clemens; and the fans followed suit after he joined the Yankees.

Take a look at how the Yankees have treated Darryl Strawberry to get a feeling for how loyal the Yankee organization is. We kept him around, and offered him jobs so he could be in baseball still. Unfortunately he could never get his problems under controll. But the Yankees STILL haven't left him. And he had some serious issues to work out, but one of them wasn't being thrown out by his baseball team.

The knowledge the Sox will never win a championship again makes me sleep peacefully at night. I can't beleive I have to move to BOSTON IN SEPTEMBER! OH NO!
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Postby tjhksig » Sun Jun 29, 2003 3:40 pm

[quote="Dr.DooM"]
Take yesterdays game against the Marlins for example. After pounding them for 14 runs in the first inning, they don't show any class whatsoever. Anyone notice Ortiz rubbing it in by showboating his homer in the second inning? What about sending Walker on a short flyball...when the score was 21-5. [quote]

I remember a quote by a manager about this. It was something along the lines of, "We'll stop scoring runs when you stop trying to catch up and tie/beat us". You never know how many runs you need to win a game, or what'll happen next inning. I remember during the M's 2001 season where they won 116 games, they were up on Cleveland by 12 in like the 8th, and they ended up losing. They had most of the starters out and were playing scrubs, and look what happened. Had they played to win the game, they would have had a ML record 117 wins, not just a ML record tying 116......
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Postby Nomar4prez » Sun Jun 29, 2003 5:40 pm

DanteNoX wrote:As a *true* Yankee fan, i would say that every fan is different. On an individual basis, the most annoying fan i know is a Mets fan, but that doesnt mean he covers all mets fans. These generalizations over fans go a bit far sometimes; afterall, all true fans are fans of the game. I respect anyone who goes out and vigorously supports their home team. Even if they are Boston fans.

PS: I was lying about the Boston fans. They are awefull fans, violent; always starting fights at Yanks-Sox games at Fenway. The organization has a history of racism, as with all other Boston teams (and unfortunately, historically with the fans as well). That black eye is large in my book. Not to say that all of baseball hasn't struggled with racism in the past century, but Boston had always been a bit more aggressively hatefull. The way they treated Clemens was a travesty. You don't disparage publicly the best pitcher your franchise has ever known. Clemens has no reason to like the Red Sox, and anyone who says he owes them loyalty or he should like them is confused about the facts. The Red Sox organization turned their backs on Clemens; and the fans followed suit after he joined the Yankees.

Take a look at how the Yankees have treated Darryl Strawberry to get a feeling for how loyal the Yankee organization is. We kept him around, and offered him jobs so he could be in baseball still. Unfortunately he could never get his problems under controll. But the Yankees STILL haven't left him. And he had some serious issues to work out, but one of them wasn't being thrown out by his baseball team.

The knowledge the Sox will never win a championship again makes me sleep peacefully at night. I can't beleive I have to move to BOSTON IN SEPTEMBER! OH NO!


I agree that the organization treated Clemens bad when he left, but the fans always loved him, even though he wasn't a "great" pitcher yet. We were all troubled that he left to go to Toronto. We were angry that he didn't even say goodbye to a city that had cheered for him for years. When he joined the Yankees, I think all Red Sox fans felt it as a slap in the face. Now I ask you how you would feel if Derek Jeter, angry at Steinbrenner, left the Yankees and joined the Red Sox. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you'd be a bit pissed at him.
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Postby Transmogrifier » Sun Jun 29, 2003 10:50 pm

Clemens is claseless... that's why I hate him.

The examples of Alfonzo, Pudge, etc. are great. Drew Bledsoe--despite bad treatment from management--took out full page ads in the local papers to thank the fans. Now that's class.

Duquette was, and is, an ass; that doesn't mean Clemens should return the favor to the fans. The real Pudge, Carlton Fisk, realized this, and went in as a Sox... Clemens should do the same.

And, to someone who said that Sox fans only have excuses.... I disagree. I think every year is this year.
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Postby RoxSox8 » Sun Jun 29, 2003 11:55 pm

As a lifelong Red Sox fan, I agree with the many posts that don't blame Buckner, but rather Stanley for the 86' series. I also think that Cal Schraldi had a lot to do with losing the series as well. He was nails at the end of the season, but come playoff time and world series, he couldn't get it done.

In terms of fans, I can respect if your passionate about your team, and the game of baseball. However, unless the names Brian Downing, Bobby Grich, Rod Carew, Donnie Moore, Wally Joyner or Kirk McCaskill mean something to you, then you should put your Angels paraphernalia in your closet, next to your Tom Brady and Brad Johnson jerseys, and watch the Osbourne Reruns on MTV, while you listen to Norah Jones, and count your money for your new LeBron James sneakers.
I'm not Mr. Lebowski man, I'm the Dude.

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Postby Dr.DooM » Mon Jun 30, 2003 12:00 am

Nomar4prez wrote: Now I ask you how you would feel if Derek Jeter, angry at Steinbrenner, left the Yankees and joined the Red Sox. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you'd be a bit pissed at him.


I think this is a good example of how Red Sox fans differ from others. Other fans don't display the same level of hatred to their ex-players that Boston does. For example, the Mets don't hate David Cone, Darryl Strawberry, or Doc Gooden for playing for the hated Yankees (and doing well).

In general, most of the hard feelings from Boston revolve around Roger doing better after leaving Boston and joining the hated Yankees. But from his perspective, he was lowballed by Duquette, called a coward by his manager, and departed under the assumption he was a player in decline. All this despite over a decade of service as Boston's ace. Now I'm sure some fans supported Roger but from my point of view, most sox fans were towing the party line and focusing on Rogers unspectacular win ratio. What did you expect him to do? Was he not supposed to play well after leaving Boston? Was he not supposed to join a contending team for the World Series? If anything, I think Boston owes Clemens, not the other way around. Maybe the fans should get together and buy a full page ad in the Globe about how Duquette was an ass and the fans appreciate what Roger has done for them.

You know, despite all this Roger has been quoted in recent interviews how he has no hard feelings toward Boston Fans and how his main problem was with Duquette. I don't expect wounds to heal overnight, but maybe Boston can show a little more respect to Roger next time he's in Fenway. Or at least not spit on his wife and kids.
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