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Keeper Player taxes/fees

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Keeper Player taxes/fees

Postby klvrdude » Thu Feb 02, 2006 9:41 pm

As it appears many people are doing this year, my league is going to an auction format. Along the way we are coming up with all of the rules to go with it.

Our current discussion surrounds how to "tax" those players that we keep from one year to the next to maintain the league's competitiveness.

One person has suggested a flat $5 increase each year, but a $5 raise is much different to a $45 dollar player then a $20 dollar player (especially over the course of 2+ years).

I'm thinking about making some pro-rated monetary increase, but would love to hear what others do!
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Postby hersch223 » Thu Feb 02, 2006 10:12 pm

We let our owners sign players to contracts. $5 for each year of the contract. So say you have a player that is $10. If you want to sign him for one more year, that year will cost $15. If you would rather sign him for 3 years, then it's $25 for each year. After a contract is up the player goes into the auction pool for next year.
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Postby klvrdude » Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:04 pm

Hersch, thanks for the reply, but that's kinda what I'm trying to avoid....an arbitrary tax for retaining players.
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Postby klvrdude » Fri Feb 03, 2006 2:30 pm

A little help please....
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Postby JTWood » Fri Feb 03, 2006 2:43 pm

I'm confused about what you're looking for here. Are you looking for suggestions that are based on the current value of the player at the time he is named as a keeper, like maybe 10% of his current cost rounded up?

I don't quite understand why you discarded hersch's suggestion as "arbitrary." It didn't seem arbitrary to me. It was a fixed charge, but it just wasn't based on the value of the player.

Anyways, maybe you can clarify what you're looking for a just little more for me? I'd be glad to throw out my two cents, but I want to make certain I know what you're looking for.

;-D
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Postby Coppermine » Fri Feb 03, 2006 2:52 pm

I believe our way of doing it is simple and effective: $1 for a first year keeper, $2 for a second, $4 for a third and so on.
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Postby tal1286 » Fri Feb 03, 2006 3:00 pm

many leagues i've seen have a straight $5 increase for a few reasons that I can think of. I think the most important one is simply that players only keep their good-value players, which is good in my opinion. if someone could just keep pujols for a minimal increase it doesn't take any skill. Adding $5 to the cost brings out the skill since, like I said, people can't just keep their best players, they have to know who is worth keeping at their values and what each player is worth.
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Postby klvrdude » Fri Feb 03, 2006 3:28 pm

JTWood wrote:I'm confused about what you're looking for here. Are you looking for suggestions that are based on the current value of the player at the time he is named as a keeper, like maybe 10% of his current cost rounded up?

I don't quite understand why you discarded hersch's suggestion as "arbitrary." It didn't seem arbitrary to me. It was a fixed charge, but it just wasn't based on the value of the player.

Anyways, maybe you can clarify what you're looking for a just little more for me? I'd be glad to throw out my two cents, but I want to make certain I know what you're looking for.

;-D


I'll try to explain why I'm not in favor of a flat fee for all players.

To pick a flat amount seems arbitrary to me. A $5 dollars increase has significantly different meanings to different situations. Say for example that there are three players drafted at $50, $25 and $10.

In the 3rd year of the league a Pujols type player is now $60??? And well this may work for your middle tier guys it certainly doesn't seem right for WW players that come up in the middle of season like King Felix and Wright type players. So I can have King Felix or Wright in the 3rd season for approx $20 b/c my WW position was 1 better then someone else?

What I'd really like to replicate, if it is at all possible, is something similar to real ball. For instance, Manny's next contract is not going to be growing by ~10% each year. I'd something that limits the keeper taxes or fees on players that have already peaked, increase for those are peaking and have modest gains for those who are middle of the pack role player

A crude idea that I'm tinkering with is havign a prorated tax based on last season's draft value.

What I'm hoping to get from the cafe is some examples of non-flat fee taxes with the hopes of modifying them for my own league.

Does that help Mr. Wood?
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Postby looptid » Fri Feb 03, 2006 6:22 pm

In my league:

-A player won at auction is locked into a three year contract. All teams know this when bidding.

-Between the second and third year of a player's contract, they can be signed to exension years at the price of a $5 increase per year for up to three years.

-Teams can dump contracts via trade or the waiver wire (the player's new team has to pick up their contract).

-Teams releasing a player before their contract has expired have to pay the total remaining sum into the prize pool. My league uses a 1/5th scale for all finances ($260 cap means $52 entry fee), so dumping a player at $10 with two years left on his deal ($20 total guarenteed money) would cost me $4. After the fine is paid the released player's contract no longer counts against a team's salary cap.

So, if you got Felix Hernandez at $15 dollars this year, and wanted to keep him for as long as you could, he would cost you:

2006 - $15
2007 - $15
2008 - $15
2009 - $20
2010 - $25
2011 - $30

Works pretty well. You could take things down to a 1/10th scale if you wanted ($260 cap is a $26 entry fee), so cutting a $10 player with two years left on his deal would be a $2 penalty.

All the money from fines gets split up among the winning teams, so it just sweetens the pot.
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Postby JTWood » Fri Feb 03, 2006 6:29 pm

Ah, I see what you're going for there, kvlr. A couple ideas I've seen:

Keepers are revalued based on actual dollar value.

I don't play $260 leagues, so I've never done the "actual" dollar value calculation, but it is my understanding that there are formulas which derive a player's real value for a $260 league based on actual statistics (and maybe other factors).

The upside of this method is that you'll be able to keep the guy you overpaid for at a much cheaper price. Same for your injured players. The downside of this is that you only get a full season max out of your sleeper that came through, since he'll be revalued at a much higher price for the next year.

This method is not suggested for contract leagues.

Exponential increase in price.

This one is simple. The guy you keep goes up in price for every consecutive year you keep him, but the amount by which his price increases by also increases (e.g. - 5%, 7%, 10%, 14%). This could be actual dollars or relative dollars, the latter of which I think you'd prefer.

This works fine enough for contract leagues, but only if you're checking future cap concerns, too.
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