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Jackies daughter not down with Clemente

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Jackies daughter not down with Clemente

Postby acsguitar » Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:19 pm

To me this is retarded. How selfish are you ?? The guy died for charity and compassion.

Jackies daughter sucks IMO

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/b ... index.html

NEW YORK (AP) -- The daughter of Jackie Robinson thinks Major League Baseball should not retire Roberto Clemente's No. 21, the New York Daily News reported Tuesday.

The Hispanics Across America advocacy group wants Clemente's number set aside the way the late Robinson's No. 42 was nine years ago. But Sharon Robinson said that honor should remain for her father only.

"To my understanding, the purpose of retiring my father's number is that what he did changed all of baseball, not only for African-Americans but also for Latinos, so I think that purpose has been met," Robinson told the newspaper at a birthday celebration for her father in Times Square. "When you start retiring numbers across the board, for all different groups, you're kind of diluting the original purpose."

In September, Washington Nationals manager Frank Robinson made similar comments, saying baseball should find another way to honor Clemente.

"Jackie Robinson was a very unique situation and historical," Robinson said. Clemente did an awful lot of good things and was a terrific ballplayer, but I don't think it's the same type of situation as Jackie Robinson. And if you do it for him, where do you go? Where do you stop? Then you neglect someone and create some big controversy."

Major League Baseball has taken the effort to retire the late Clemente's number under advisement.

Sharon Robinson said she is close to the Clemente family and acknowledged that the Hall of Famer is an inspiration to Hispanic athletes.

"I totally think that Roberto's accomplishments should continue to be spotlighted and highlighted as a major part of baseball, and American culture -- as well as Puerto Rico's culture," she told the newspaper.

Clemente, a 12-time All-Star who had 3,000 hits for the Pittsburgh Pirates, died in 1972 at age 38 in a plane crash. He was taking relief supplies to victims of a Nicaraguan earthquake.


I guess the hispanics weren't hated enough to warrent this or something...actually I have no idea why she is arguing this
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Postby Phatferd » Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:43 pm

I agree with her.

Should the NBA retire the first HS player to get drafted? He had a huge part it changing the NBA forever.

I think what Clemente has done and what he accomplished should be remembered, but I don't know if doing the exact same thing they did for Robinson is the right thing to do.

You begin to water down the accomplishments of others if you begin to retire a whole bunch of players numbers.

I feel Robinson did help pave the wave for Latin players and ultimately Clemente, therefore I don't think he should be given the same honor as Robinson.
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Postby 1337_Dude » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:03 pm

I don't see why anyone has a problem with retiring Clemente's Number. They are both known more for what they did for other people then their stats (Both of which were very good). I think that poverty in the countries he was helping others in was/is a big of an issue as racism is here. Many people have died due to both reasons, and these guys were champions for the cause. One of the big things that hurts Clemente is that racism was a bigger problem at the time in terms of being talked about and that leads a lot of people to say what he did was more important. Saying that Clemente shouldn't get the same kind of honor as Robinson because Robinson paved the way for Clemente seems very silly to me.
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Postby bronxxbomber » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:29 pm

1337_Dude wrote:I don't see why anyone has a problem with retiring Clemente's Number. They are both known more for what they did for other people then their stats (Both of which were very good). I think that poverty in the countries he was helping others in was/is a big of an issue as racism is here. Many people have died due to both reasons, and these guys were champions for the cause. One of the big things that hurts Clemente is that racism was a bigger problem at the time in terms of being talked about and that leads a lot of people to say what he did was more important. Saying that Clemente shouldn't get the same kind of honor as Robinson because Robinson paved the way for Clemente seems very silly to me.
I agree with you here, but as long as his number is retired with the team I'm fine with whatever ruling regardless.
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Postby Coppermine » Thu Jan 26, 2006 10:30 am

I think that she is right... I'm sorry guys.

The first though I had when i heard this was how selfish Jackie Robinson's daughter is being; the nerve of her to suggest that her father is so special that he is the ONLY player who deserves to have his number retired by every team.

Well, he is. Jackie Robinson's circumstances as a player, both on and off the field, warrant this kind of special recognition. Dont' get me wrong, I love Clemente; he was not only a great player but also one of the most charitable, loving philanthropists of his time, and all that as a hispanic minority, helping the people of his country, giving back with the talents he was born with. He also tied a beloved, martyr-esque person who will be remembered forever not just for what he did, but also everythign that he could have done had he lived.

But all that aside, Jackie Robinson's number being retired is something absolutely special and without precedent. It's a truly unique case, the man who broke the color barrier in baseball and played his ass off to boot. Retiring his number isn't about his playing ability for his philanthropy; it was about him changing the face of the game forever and for ushering baseball into a new era of understanding and enlightenment. Everyone knows Jackie Robinson because he was the man who broke that color barrier and then, subsequently, led the Dodgers to the world series.

So, I'm not saying that Roberto Clemente isn't deserving, nor am I saying that Jackie Robinson is in any way superior. I just believe that, given the tradition of baseball and what his number being permanently retired stands for, it should be the precedent that he is and will always be the only player whose number graces the outfield walls of every baseball field from now until forever.
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Postby Madison » Thu Jan 26, 2006 11:58 am

Coppermine wrote:I think that she is right... I'm sorry guys.

The first though I had when i heard this was how selfish Jackie Robinson's daughter is being; the nerve of her to suggest that her father is so special that he is the ONLY player who deserves to have his number retired by every team.

Well, he is. Jackie Robinson's circumstances as a player, both on and off the field, warrant this kind of special recognition. Dont' get me wrong, I love Clemente; he was not only a great player but also one of the most charitable, loving philanthropists of his time, and all that as a hispanic minority, helping the people of his country, giving back with the talents he was born with. He also tied a beloved, martyr-esque person who will be remembered forever not just for what he did, but also everythign that he could have done had he lived.

But all that aside, Jackie Robinson's number being retired is something absolutely special and without precedent. It's a truly unique case, the man who broke the color barrier in baseball and played his ass off to boot. Retiring his number isn't about his playing ability for his philanthropy; it was about him changing the face of the game forever and for ushering baseball into a new era of understanding and enlightenment. Everyone knows Jackie Robinson because he was the man who broke that color barrier and then, subsequently, led the Dodgers to the world series.

So, I'm not saying that Roberto Clemente isn't deserving, nor am I saying that Jackie Robinson is in any way superior. I just believe that, given the tradition of baseball and what his number being permanently retired stands for, it should be the precedent that he is and will always be the only player whose number graces the outfield walls of every baseball field from now until forever.


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Postby acsguitar » Thu Jan 26, 2006 11:58 am

Seems like they are saying black people's cause is more important then hispanics
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Postby Phatferd » Thu Jan 26, 2006 12:22 pm

acsguitar wrote:Seems like they are saying black people's cause is more important then hispanics


I think you're totally missing the point.

Jackie Robinson represents all minorities, not just blacks. Clemente wa s a great human being, nobody is denying that. Clemente didn't change the way the game was played or how it was operated.

Clemente did wonderful things for his home country, where poverty is a huge problem. This, however, didn't change anything with baseball. It changed his home country, but baseball wasn't affected by it.

Schilling, Mo Vaughn, Mark McGwire, Barry Bonds, Rex Hudler, etc all donate or donated a lot of their personal money for charitable causes. Should they all have their numbers retired?

I think Clemente should be honored, and the best way would be to donate a large sum of money to his charity or for MLB to create another charity in his name that will help poverty stricken people in South and Latin America.
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Postby Art Vandelay » Thu Jan 26, 2006 12:29 pm

I don't think that honoring one player diminishes the accomplishments of another. Jackie Robinson definitely did more to change the game of baseball than Clemente did, I think we can all pretty much agree on that. But that doesn't mean that retiring Clemente's number would be a slap in the face to Robinson. In the end it really doesn't matter to me what they decide to do, but Robinson's family complaining like this, especially publicly, comes off as sour grapes. People who are the descendants of famous historical figures often take offense to anything percieved as rubbing a little shine off of the lore of their ancestors (ie: the Jefferson family when all the Sally Hemmings stuff came out).
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Postby acsguitar » Thu Jan 26, 2006 12:37 pm

Art Vandelay wrote:I don't think that honoring one player diminishes the accomplishments of another. Jackie Robinson definitely did more to change the game of baseball than Clemente did, I think we can all pretty much agree on that. But that doesn't mean that retiring Clemente's number would be a slap in the face to Robinson. In the end it really doesn't matter to me what they decide to do, but Robinson's family complaining like this, especially publicly, comes off as sour grapes. People who are the descendants of famous historical figures often take offense to anything percieved as rubbing a little shine off of the lore of their ancestors (ie: the Jefferson family when all the Sally Hemmings stuff came out).


Exactly....its like well my dad was better then you so you can't have the same honor...BS!
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