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Opinions on forefeiting the Saves category

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Postby Wind Dancer » Thu Jun 19, 2003 5:05 pm

:-t Well...in the past 24 hours....my closers....have made a big impact on my weekly points......Smoltz and Wagner...2 blown saves, 2 losses, 4 k's, ERA of 9.00, and WHIP of 2.50...yeah...closers make a difference :-t
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Postby CaptainJenks » Thu Jun 19, 2003 5:49 pm

I say dont completly forfeit them just grab smoltz or gagne and one other closer and you should around 5th in or 6th in a 12 team league.
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Postby brdmaverick » Thu Jun 19, 2003 6:27 pm

Hello, yes, it was I who posted on whether or not I should forfeit the steals category. The reasoning for considering such a thing is that I am in a H2H 6x6 roto league. Therefore, I am not looking to beat 11 other teams on a weekly basis, just the one I am playing against. With that being said, I am considering just forfeiting steals and be content with winning with scores like 7-5 and 8-4. I, however, would not suggest this tactic in a straight out roto league. Because if you come in dead last in steals (or saves) you would only get 1 point, therefore you would have to be near flawless in other areas to win first place. That is not the case in H2H which is the only reason I am considering it.


Of course, the downside to my tactic is the fact that I have to work hard for every category while I am basically handing my opponent a free win every week. This defintely does concern me for the playoffs, because I will only be playing against the best teams then, and they would be able to compete with me in R,HR, and RBI.

It may come back to haunt me then, but I may role the dice and forgo steals and see how it turns out.

So if you are in a regular roto league, I would definitely suggest that you not forfeit saves. Though you may want to at least consider it in a H2H league.
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Postby jdh » Thu Jun 19, 2003 6:30 pm

In a roto 5x5 league, punting either steals or saves is a very bad idea, because it puts the rest of your team in such a hole that you need to pretty much win most or all of the other categories if you take a minimum score in one category. It also leaves very little room for error, and makes injuries that much more devestating. To win a roto league, you pretty much need to be at least middle of the pack in every category, and average a third place across all categories.

In h2h, punting saves or steals or even both is a more sound strategy. With h2h, your only real goal in the regular season section of the season is to win enough categories across enough weeks to put yourself into the playoffs. Once you are in the playoffs, anything can and will happen, and with only a one week sample period, the best team isn't always going to win. You can easily win enough category weeks in h2h without taking saves or steals to make the playoffs. Once in the playoffs, saves and steals aren't important either because you just need to win a majority of categories to move on. In dumping saves gives you a much better chance of winning 2-3 other categories in h2h, I'd go for it.
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Postby BeautifulBrunette » Thu Jun 19, 2003 7:13 pm

Oh guys, FYI: my league is 12 team H2H and my closers are Koch, MacDougal and L. Carter. I have Cordero on the bench & hope to use him soon. My starters are Mussina, J. Schmidt, Seo, Washburn, B. Myers, Pavano, BH Kim, M. Redman (and Ainsworth on my DL).

BB ;-D
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Postby kentx12 » Thu Jun 19, 2003 7:25 pm

CaptainJenks wrote:I say dont completly forfeit them just grab smoltz or gagne and one other closer and you should around 5th in or 6th in a 12 team league.


I would say if you were not trying to win saves don't grab Smoltz or Gagne. Both of them have gone in the 1st or 2nd round of the midseason drafts I have been in this year and I believe that is too high unless you put a high priority on saves. You can take your hitting and pitching early and always pick up a couple closers like Baez, Julio, Williams. Take closers that get fewer saves and try to start as many of them as you can. Just my oppinion.
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Postby DGroundhog » Fri Jun 20, 2003 1:34 am

There is a few small difference between the steals and saves categories. Most leagues require you to start a RP or 2. Most RP's aren't going to suck down your other pitching stats, like so many steals guys do. I would never want to settle for last in a category, but I would not draft a Smoltz or Gagne in the first 2 rounds. I use Izzy and Baez 'cuz they're cheap. I'll finish mid-pack in saves, but I will again dominate W's, K's, ERA, and WHIP. I always do.

I also don't draft steals guys. I drafted Sheffield, but not for his steals. I grabbed Byrnes, but not for his steals. I'll take the steals I get from guys that can hit .300 and hit a HR, hopefully 30-40 of them. Again, I finish mid-pack in steals, but I dominate HR's, runs, RBI, and AVG. You would think by not having the speed guys, I would not be near the top in runs, yet I always am. My squads hit .300 year after year.
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Postby Madison » Fri Jun 20, 2003 1:48 am

In a roto league it kills you to punt steals or saves. In a h2h league, if you are very, very good in the other catagories, you have a shot.
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Postby wrveres » Fri Jun 20, 2003 6:21 am

I have played for many years, and I have never seen anybody win by punting saves. Never. It just puts way to much pressure on the rest of the team.
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Postby dannahann » Fri Jun 20, 2003 10:53 am

The deeper the league and the more categories you count, the easier it gets to punt a category like saves or steals and still win. Completely punting a category in anything less than a 10 team (Al or NL) or 14 team mixed will make it tough to win. It's a dead certain lock that you can't win a 4x4 roto league by punting (unless it's full of morons) Even 5x5 it's a VERY REMOTE possibility at best.
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