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Somehow I'm not really Surprised.

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Postby Pogotheostrich » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:09 pm

Mookie4ever wrote:Something else occured to me.

You know how on the pumps they tell you how the price of gas is broken down x% for crude, x% for marketing and profit, x% taxes and x% for refining costs?

The gas companies were still getting the same percentage it was just that the size of the pie got bigger because of the jump in the cost of crude. The same must also be true for the State and Provincial governments that get a piece of the pie. Those guys must have taken in record taxes from the gas tax. I wonder what they are doing with our money :-?
Not sure about Canada but in IL and MO it isn't a % of the cost but a set rate.
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Postby RugbyD » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:10 pm

Mookie4ever wrote: Those guys must have taken in record taxes from the gas tax. I wonder what they are doing with our money :-?


Probably buying lots of velvet-covered rope to contain the lines of people waiting for MRIs ;-)
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Postby RugbyD » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:14 pm

We are leaving out the real criminals here: corn farmers. Ethanol is ore expensive and less efficient than gas. My poor Nissan is force-fed that crap at a 10% rate every fill-up. :~( :-t
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Postby Coppermine » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:21 pm

I'm curious about the pros and cons of ethanol.

I live in an area where they are proposing to build the first Ethanol Distillery in Pennsylvania. The local residents are furious about it and fighting it tooth and nail. My question is, what's the big deal?

Ethanol seems like a good thing for the most part... at least it's environmentally friendly. If it's more expensive and less efficient, I don't see why anyone would want to buy it anyway... that's basic enonomics, basic marginal utility.

But why is the plant makes it such a bad thing, why is being fought? It's not a coal power plant or anything like that... I just don't know enough about ethanol to have an opinion.
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Postby Cornbread Maxwell » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:23 pm

You bring up a lot of important points in this thread mookie. Ima as capitalistic as the next American, but I also believe that there has been widespread abuses in pricing in this industry, and it needs to be investigated. Also - you make a great point about taxation, is taxation of gas a set rate per gallon, or is it based on a % of price - if the latter, how much extra surplus is that bringing in and where is that surplus going to?
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Postby RugbyD » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:29 pm

Coppermine wrote:I'm curious about the pros and cons of ethanol.

I live in an area where they are proposing to build the first Ethanol Distillery in Pennsylvania. The local residents are furious about it and fighting it tooth and nail. My question is, what's the big deal?

Ethanol seems like a good thing for the most part... at least it's environmentally friendly. If it's more expensive and less efficient, I don't see why anyone would want to buy it anyway... that's basic enonomics, basic marginal utility.

But why is the plant makes it such a bad thing, why is being fought? It's not a coal power plant or anything like that... I just don't know enough about ethanol to have an opinion.


Its not environmentally friendly by any means, it just pollutes in a different way than gasoline.

well-rounded article on the basics:
http://www.courier-journal.com/apps/pbc ... /504210377
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Postby Coppermine » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:33 pm

Well, I'm sold... ethanol sucks.
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Postby Mookie4ever » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:35 pm

Cornbread Maxwell wrote:You bring up a lot of important points in this thread mookie. Ima as capitalistic as the next American, but I also believe that there has been widespread abuses in pricing in this industry, and it needs to be investigated. Also - you make a great point about taxation, is taxation of gas a set rate per gallon, or is it based on a % of price - if the latter, how much extra surplus is that bringing in and where is that surplus going to?


I'm pretty sure that in Ontario the provincial tax is a percentage of total cost at the pump.

Somebody in this thread said that in the States that it is a fixed amount but somehow I doubt that.

I found this from a 2002 study:

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Link.

I don't know whether the 31% was on average what it worked out to or whether it was a set 31%.

Taxes - Taxes, including federal and local, account for about 31 percent of the total price of gas in the United States. Federal excise taxes are 18.4 cents per gallon, and state excise taxes average 20 cents per gallon. There may also be some additional state sales taxes, as well as local and city taxes. In Europe, gas prices are far higher than in America because taxes on gas are much higher. For example, gas prices in England have risen as high as $6 per gallon, with 78 percent of that going to taxes.


It seems as if the federal rate is a fixed amount per gallon but that State taxes are a percentage.
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Postby Pogotheostrich » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:45 pm

Mookie4ever wrote:Somebody in this thread said that in the States that it is a fixed amount but somehow I doubt that.


All 50 states apply a flat-rate tax on each gallon of gas sold, with an average of 21.8 cents per gallon, according to the American Petroleum Institute.

That's in addition to state sales taxes, usually between 2 percent and 6 percent, and a federal tax of 18.4 cents per gallon.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/09/06/pf/taxes/gas_tax/
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Postby Mookie4ever » Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:49 pm

Pogotheostrich wrote:
Mookie4ever wrote:Somebody in this thread said that in the States that it is a fixed amount but somehow I doubt that.


All 50 states apply a flat-rate tax on each gallon of gas sold, with an average of 21.8 cents per gallon, according to the American Petroleum Institute.

That's in addition to state sales taxes, usually between 2 percent and 6 percent, and a federal tax of 18.4 cents per gallon.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/09/06/pf/taxes/gas_tax/


Nice find ;-D
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