bigh0rt wrote:Just one thing to add to this thread:
You can't be sipping the Cashman Kool-Aid on all the positives the Yankees have done under his guidance, and then turn around and say he had nothing to do with the crapper deals. He's either in on both or in on neither. None of this bending of logic to shed some sort of false light on the guy. What he was/wasn't involved with, I don't really care, nor do I think we ever get the full story on. Be that as it may, he's brought in some talent, and he's brought in some garbage. You can justify and spin it any way you want to your heart's desire, but at the end of the day, it's there in black and white. He's no super-GM, but I don't think he's some hack, either.
Just pick, though. Either he was involved in bringing in the goods as well as the trash, or he had nothing to do with either. You can't have your cake and eat it too. It makes your argument invalid and unsound.
Everything prior to 2001 I agree with. Any crapper deal he made back then was on him and him alone. But since 2001, there have been alot of other figures that have played major roles in the decision-making.
I don't give Cashman credit for Sheffield or most of the other big signings post-2001. I don't think he had much to do with anything since then, good or bad. I don't think he's a great GM. But these guys think he's a complete joker and he isn't. He's a solid GM. Not great, not awful.
davidmarver wrote:Bronx, as ridiculous as the spending is, do you think George would pay him what he does if Cashman didn't have to make any decisions?
You really don't know much about Steinbrenner, do you?
davidmarver wrote:Bronx, as ridiculous as the spending is, do you think George would pay him what he does if Cashman didn't have to make any decisions?
You really don't know much about Steinbrenner, do you?
That sounds like a complete cop-out to me. Elaborate, please.
davidmarver wrote:Bronx, as ridiculous as the spending is, do you think George would pay him what he does if Cashman didn't have to make any decisions?
You really don't know much about Steinbrenner, do you?
That sounds like a complete cop-out to me. Elaborate, please.
Actually, it wouldn't surprise me at all if Stein really does believe Cashman is a fantastic GM who's worth the money, but doesn't see his role as GM the same way we do. Stein certainly has felt the need to step in in the past, right or wrong; but his drive to interfere doesn't necessarily impact his view of Cashman's qualities, if that makes sense.
davidmarver wrote:Bronx, as ridiculous as the spending is, do you think George would pay him what he does if Cashman didn't have to make any decisions?
You really don't know much about Steinbrenner, do you?
I do know that Steinbrenner is a multi-billionaire, and you don't get to that status by giving away multi-millions to people you don't need.
davidmarver wrote:Bronx, as ridiculous as the spending is, do you think George would pay him what he does if Cashman didn't have to make any decisions?
You really don't know much about Steinbrenner, do you?
I do know that Steinbrenner is a multi-billionaire, and you don't get to that status by giving away multi-millions to people you don't need.
But you do get to that status if Daddy owns a subsidiary of American Shipbuilding.
You don't think there are plenty of people in corporate America who are making more than they're worth? I could name a bunch from personal experience...
davidmarver wrote:Bronx, as ridiculous as the spending is, do you think George would pay him what he does if Cashman didn't have to make any decisions?
You really don't know much about Steinbrenner, do you?
That sounds like a complete cop-out to me. Elaborate, please.
Sorry, I should have. I DO believe that Steinbrenner likes Cashman. I think he knows that Cash has the ability to target players and close big deals. Cashman is well-respected throughout baseball from what I have read. He knows how to get deals done. George respects that.
However, Cashman is also George's lackey. George is comfortable with him. He can knock Cash around and he knows that Brian won't say anything. Again, I think George really likes Cashman, but he is too impressionable. The Tampa guys don't like him, and they fight with him.
A perfect example is the Sheffield/Guerrero debacle. Cashman wanted Vlad, but Tampa wanted Sheffield. Instead of letting his GM handle the situation and trust him to make the right decision, George had a vote between everyone. The Tampa faction voted for Sheffield (including Sheff's uncle Doc Gooden) and he won.
That is how business is conducted in the organization. Let's not also forget that this is George Steinbrenner. He isn't scared of overpaying to get what he wants.
davidmarver wrote:Bronx, as ridiculous as the spending is, do you think George would pay him what he does if Cashman didn't have to make any decisions?
You really don't know much about Steinbrenner, do you?
I do know that Steinbrenner is a multi-billionaire, and you don't get to that status by giving away multi-millions to people you don't need.
Have you watched the Yankees over the past 5 years? They've given multi-millions to people they don't need on mulitple occasions.
As a Darth Steinbrenner detractor, I have felt horrible for Cashman all year. I wondered how he made it through all the second guessing, the circus act down in florida and the baffoon named George. I thought for sure Cashman had, had enough and was going to leave. Well Cashman really suprised me this week, he showed how weak a man he really is. He showed the courage of a 5 year old boy against a teen age bully. I hope Cashman gets what he deserves - yet another year of finger pointing, limited decision making, and all the flak for yet another floundering year. He deserves it - he is a coward! A wealthy coward - perhaps Cashman can go buy a backbone with his new contract. LOL
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by davidmarver » Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:46 pm 
