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Cashman Agrees to 3-Year Deal with Yankees

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Postby WharfRat » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:14 pm

George_Foreman wrote:in fairness, david, $/W is only a reasonable assesment of GM performance (sounds like a car commercial, no?) if you're in a system where teams have at least a somewhat similar amount of cash to spend. In the case of the yankees, they can afford to over-pay quite a bit in order to bring in the premium talent. it's the reason that, say, arod would be a horrible signing for the Rangers but is a good one for the yanks: while he isn't as "efficient" a signing, the yankee's don't need to be efficient.

don't get me wrong, that doesn't mean the yankee's arn't full of unarguably "bad" contracts (brown... :-P ), it just means that their GM is measured by a different yardstick than other ones, and rightfully so.


Exactly, this is the point I was trying to make.
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Postby davidmarver » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:14 pm

Cashman has very, very little to do with the Yankees being the most valued team. I actually wonder if there has ever been a time when they weren't the highest valued team.

I think that has to do with, o I don't know, the population of New York, the New York Yankees history, and their partnerships with other sports franchises (such as Manchester United, the highest grossing soccer team in the world).

So now Cashman isn't responsible for the moves the team makes, but he is responsible for how much the team is worth. Right. :-?
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Postby WharfRat » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:21 pm

davidmarver wrote:Cashman has very, very little to do with the Yankees being the most valued team. I actually wonder if there has ever been a time when they weren't the highest valued team.

I think that has to do with, o I don't know, the population of New York, the New York Yankees history, and their partnerships with other sports franchises (such as Manchester United, the highest grossing soccer team in the world).

So now Cashman isn't responsible for the moves the team makes, but he is responsible for how much the team is worth. Right. :-?


Cashman isn't responsible for value, but it's an additional asset he gets to work with. A dollar means more to Allard Baird than Brian Cashman.
Last edited by WharfRat on Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:42 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby dyuen87 » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:27 pm

davidmarver wrote:
WharfRat wrote:
davidmarver wrote:Someone, somewhere in New York is screwing up.


Well done, you've proved the Yankees have problems. What you haven't proved, however, is that the people screwing up are in New York, rather than say, I dunno, Tampa.

Are you trying to pinpoint the Yankees problems on George Steinbrenner?

What are you going to do, fire him?

Please, the reason I related money and wins is because there really is three factors involved.

Wins is dependent on Torre/Players while Money is dependent on Cashman/Players. The players Torre recieves is dependent upon Cashman. Either Torre or Cashman has screwed up and there really isn't much of an argument against that.


okay stop worrying about what the yankees are doing. steinbrenner's not breaking any rules by spending money. if you were a yankee fan, fine go on about how we dont have any championships for the past few years. but coming from a padre fan? how about getting 90 wins next season okay? oh yeah tell peavy theres a party the day before the season starts, let him hurt his ribs again. wins is dependent on the skill of players/managers, something the yankees have and the padres clearly lack.
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Postby RocketsDWM » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:28 pm

dyuen87 wrote:
davidmarver wrote:
WharfRat wrote:
davidmarver wrote:Someone, somewhere in New York is screwing up.


Well done, you've proved the Yankees have problems. What you haven't proved, however, is that the people screwing up are in New York, rather than say, I dunno, Tampa.

Are you trying to pinpoint the Yankees problems on George Steinbrenner?

What are you going to do, fire him?

Please, the reason I related money and wins is because there really is three factors involved.

Wins is dependent on Torre/Players while Money is dependent on Cashman/Players. The players Torre recieves is dependent upon Cashman. Either Torre or Cashman has screwed up and there really isn't much of an argument against that.


okay stop worrying about what the yankees are doing. steinbrenner's not breaking any rules by spending money. if you were a yankee fan, fine go on about how we dont have any championships for the past few years. but coming from a padre fan? how about getting 90 wins next season okay? oh yeah tell peavy theres a party the day before the season starts, let him hurt his ribs again. wins is dependent on the skill of players/managers, something the yankees have and the padres clearly lack.


Correct me if I am wrong, but I dont think he was comparing the Padres with the Yanks....
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Postby BronXBombers51 » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:34 pm

DM...

Go learn something about how the Yankees are run before you make judgements. Nobody is saying they are well-run. They are terribly run. I'll be the first to admit that.

It is not Cashman and Torre's faults though. They don't make the decisions. If you knew anything about the Yankees, you'd know that.
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Postby blankman » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:36 pm

RocketsDWM wrote:Didnt Cashman develop the farm system that included Rivera and Jeter - the building blocks of the Yanks? Not sure but I thought I heard that somewhere.


No. He wasn't the GM then. It was Gene Michael who drafted Jeter etc.

Stick Michael (the guy that should be GM), Showalter, the scouts and a group of others were responsible for those players and are often given the credit for the dynasty, not Cashman.

I can't say I'm happy about this. I'm not pissed off, but I'm not sure what to think. :-/
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Postby RocketsDWM » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:39 pm

blankman wrote:
RocketsDWM wrote:Didnt Cashman develop the farm system that included Rivera and Jeter - the building blocks of the Yanks? Not sure but I thought I heard that somewhere.


No. He wasn't the GM then. It was Gene Michael who drafted Jeter etc.

Stick Michael (the guy that should be GM), Showalter, the scouts and a group of others were responsible for those players and are often given the credit for the dynasty, not Cashman.

I can't say I'm happy about this. I'm not pissed off, but I'm not sure what to think. :-/


My bad :-]
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Postby BronXBombers51 » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:40 pm

blankman wrote:
RocketsDWM wrote:Didnt Cashman develop the farm system that included Rivera and Jeter - the building blocks of the Yanks? Not sure but I thought I heard that somewhere.


No. He wasn't the GM then. It was Gene Michael who drafted Jeter etc.

Stick Michael (the guy that should be GM), Showalter, the scouts and a group of others were responsible for those players and are often given the credit for the dynasty, not Cashman.

I can't say I'm happy about this. I'm not pissed off, but I'm not sure what to think. :-/


Cashman was, however, the guy who brought in David Wells (the first time, when he was an absolute beast) Chuck Knoblauch, Scott Brosius, Roger Clemens, Alfonso Soriano, David Justice, etc.

All moves which were vital to the Yankee dynasty. When the Yankees blew it in 2001, the front office lost credibility with Steinbrenner, and he turned into the old George. That is why this team has been run so differently. That's why Cashman and Torre and Michael have no say. That's why the show is run by morons like Emslie, Oppenheimer and Connors.
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Postby blankman » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:58 pm

BronXBombers51 wrote:
blankman wrote:
RocketsDWM wrote:Didnt Cashman develop the farm system that included Rivera and Jeter - the building blocks of the Yanks? Not sure but I thought I heard that somewhere.


No. He wasn't the GM then. It was Gene Michael who drafted Jeter etc.

Stick Michael (the guy that should be GM), Showalter, the scouts and a group of others were responsible for those players and are often given the credit for the dynasty, not Cashman.

I can't say I'm happy about this. I'm not pissed off, but I'm not sure what to think. :-/


Cashman was, however, the guy who brought in David Wells (the first time, when he was an absolute beast) Chuck Knoblauch, Scott Brosius, Roger Clemens, Alfonso Soriano, David Justice, etc.

All moves which were vital to the Yankee dynasty. When the Yankees blew it in 2001, the front office lost credibility with Steinbrenner, and he turned into the old George. That is why this team has been run so differently. That's why Cashman and Torre and Michael have no say. That's why the show is run by morons like Emslie, Oppenheimer and Connors.


Yes, but he also brought in all that trash Yanks04 listed. You picked out 7 or so good moves, to the 30+ awful ones. He gave away Brazoban in the Weaver/Brown deal to add to that list Yanks made. As far as I know, he also told George no when George wanted Ortiz a few years ago.

We both know that its obvious that there are bigger problems in the leadership of the team than him, but I just don't see how Cashman has done enough to warrant having a job no less a big extension.

I sure hope I'm wrong and he finally, after several years of utter trash, fixes the bullpen and the rotation. The job he's done there has been abysmal.
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