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Is there every a reason to fold Pocket Aces in Hold Em?

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Postby j24jags » Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:24 pm

if im in a late position (preferably just right of the raiser) it depends how many people called: if there r no callers yet, im calling. if there is caller w/ a very small stack ill still call b/c he prob has to make a move sooner or later. with multiple callers i can understand laying it down b/c somewhere cud pull a straight, flush, 2 pair, trips etc.
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Re: .

Postby Madison » Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:35 pm

j24jags wrote:if im in a late position (preferably just right of the raiser) it depends how many people called: if there r no callers yet, im calling. if there is caller w/ a very small stack ill still call b/c he prob has to make a move sooner or later. with multiple callers i can understand laying it down b/c somewhere cud pull a straight, flush, 2 pair, trips etc.


Actually the play in late position is to reraise big and push out the mediocre hands and leaving yourself heads up with the guy who's all in, or at worst getting one caller (for a sidepot) and the guy who's all in. :-)
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Re: .

Postby j24jags » Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:37 pm

Madison wrote:
j24jags wrote:if im in a late position (preferably just right of the raiser) it depends how many people called: if there r no callers yet, im calling. if there is caller w/ a very small stack ill still call b/c he prob has to make a move sooner or later. with multiple callers i can understand laying it down b/c somewhere cud pull a straight, flush, 2 pair, trips etc.


Actually the play in late position is to reraise big and push out the mediocre hands and leaving yourself heads up with the guy who's all in, or at worst getting one caller (for a sidepot) and the guy who's all in. :-)


no i was assuming i was being put allin already
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Re: .

Postby Madison » Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:52 pm

j24jags wrote:
Madison wrote:
j24jags wrote:if im in a late position (preferably just right of the raiser) it depends how many people called: if there r no callers yet, im calling. if there is caller w/ a very small stack ill still call b/c he prob has to make a move sooner or later. with multiple callers i can understand laying it down b/c somewhere cud pull a straight, flush, 2 pair, trips etc.


Actually the play in late position is to reraise big and push out the mediocre hands and leaving yourself heads up with the guy who's all in, or at worst getting one caller (for a sidepot) and the guy who's all in. :-)


no i was assuming i was being put allin already


Oh ok, gotcha. ;-)
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Postby AT » Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:42 am

It's the only hand you can't fold pre-flop no matter what the situation. And given your situation when you're short stacked you absolutely can't fold KK. Any other hand you have to play your read and can't be crucified for laying down QQ, AK, or otherwise.

But if you lay those hands down you're a *expletive for the female love hole*
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Postby Madison » Tue Oct 04, 2005 3:15 am

Atrophying Testicles wrote:It's the only hand you can't fold pre-flop no matter what the situation.


Disagree. Read my first post in this thread. ;-)

Also, there are times where A/A is not favored to win. 3 people or more in the pot, and A/A is not the favorite to win the hand. Why sacrifice your chips/money when you're not the favorite? The object of the game is to get all your money in with the best hand preflop. While A/A is the best hand possible, when there are 3 or more people in the pot, you are not the favorite to win the hand, so I really don't blame anyone for tossing A/A unless they are just totally shortstacked, and going out in that spot doesn't make any difference (say going out in 100th out of a tourney that pays the top 32 for example). In that case, play it. If you bust the odds and they hold up, you quadruple up (or more) and are back in the tourney. If you lose (as the odds state you will) then it didn't matter anyway.
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Postby bigken117 » Tue Oct 04, 2005 9:22 am

Actually AA will always be favored to win any hand preflop, no matter the # of callers. It's just not as overwhelming a favorite like it would be heads up.

Maybe if you had AA and you were up against AJ suited, AQ suited, and KK, where you can't get a set, all the kings are available, and there are two seperate flush draws. :-o But you still have the best hand, and someone would need to catch cards to beat you.
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Postby chadlincoln » Tue Oct 04, 2005 10:16 am

Never. Ever.

Oh wait, I thought you meant if you were playing for fake chips on Party Poker. Nevermind. ;-D
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Postby Madison » Wed Oct 05, 2005 7:12 am

bigken117 wrote:Actually AA will always be favored to win any hand preflop, no matter the # of callers. It's just not as overwhelming a favorite like it would be heads up.

Maybe if you had AA and you were up against AJ suited, AQ suited, and KK, where you can't get a set, all the kings are available, and there are two seperate flush draws. :-o But you still have the best hand, and someone would need to catch cards to beat you.


True, but with 4 or 5 callers, you're down around 30% chance to win the hand. I like pocket aces as much as anyone, but putting my whole tournament at risk on a 30% shot isn't something I do. It's about the same odds as if you are holding a/2 suited clubs and flop 2 clubs. About 30% to catch the nut flush. I watch people go down the drain every single day putting all their money up on bad draws like that.

All depends on chipstack though. Shortstacked, you really don't have a choice but to play the hand and hope it goes against the odds and actually holds up. If chips are not an issue, easy to lay it down since the odds of A/A holding up are so poor against a bunch of opponents.
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Postby bigken117 » Wed Oct 05, 2005 8:05 am

If 8 hands were played out to the river, AA would only win 12% of the time. That just gives people incentive to call with their J/4, which I've seen both online and in person too many times :-[ In the long run it's those people that lose though.
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