Just doing some reading yesterday came across some references to MacPhail and a few others executives who made it to the Hall of Fame. There are very few, unless you include the now less-powerful League presidents.
Got me thinking .... which GMs, owners, front-office innovators will eventually be enshrined? Let's leave managers out of it for the time being.
Thoughts?
George Steinbrenner?
Billy Beane?
John Schuerholz?
Pogotheostrich wrote:John Schuerholz is the only one IMO.
Are you forgetting about Pat Gillick?
As GM of the Jays 1984 to 1994 he won 5 division titles and 2 WS.
GM of the Orioles 1995 to 1997 and got them to playoffs in 1996 and 1997.
Then went to the Mariners where they had a record of 393-255 under him (the best in baseball during that span).
Gillick won more WS than Schuerholz and was successful with 3 different teams. At least equal to, if not better than, Schuerholz.
Pogotheostrich wrote:John Schuerholz is the only one IMO.
Are you forgetting about Pat Gillick?
As GM of the Jays 1984 to 1994 he won 5 division titles and 2 WS. GM of the Orioles 1995 to 1997 and got them to playoffs in 1996 and 1997. Then went to the Mariners where they had a record of 393-255 under him (the best in baseball during that span).
Gillick won more WS than Schuerholz and was successful with 3 different teams. At least equal to, if not better than, Schuerholz.
I'm leaving for the day here in a minute so I don't have time to check but didn't Gillick leave those teams in shambles?
Also wasn't Schuerholz pretty successfull with the Royals?
In all seriousness, I like all the guys you listed. Steinbrenner will probably make it despite all the bad moves he's made (and almost made) because of his sheer power over any other team. Schuerholz despite no postseason success has won 14 straight division titles, which nobody will disagree with. Beane will need 10-15 more years of excellence, which I do believe he will get, and will probably make it.
OK so I had some time to check. Gillick leaves the Jays in 94 and they averaged 69 wins for the next 3 years. After 97 he leaves the Orioles and they average 77 wins in the next 3 years. Seattle collapsed last year. Seems like he knows when to leave. I'll take continued success over that.
Here's a name for you Bud Selig. Introduced the WC, interleague play and realigned the divisions. He is stained by the 94 strike, attempted contraction, and being a puppet for the owners.
Pogotheostrich wrote:OK so I had some time to check. Gillick leaves the Jays in 94 and they averaged 69 wins for the next 3 years. After 97 he leaves the Orioles and they average 77 wins in the next 3 years. Seattle collapsed last year. Seems like he knows when to leave. I'll take continued success over that.
I don't understand your point - Gillick is responsible for the failure after he leaves?
He didn't saddle the Jays with horrible contracts. I'm not as familiar with the Orioles and Mariners but I don't believe that he can be faulted for their collapses either.
I guess the issue is whether you consider just making the playoffs a success or whether you would need to win the big enchilada every once in a while. Comparing Gillick vs. Beane there is no comparison. Gillick's teams have been regular season successes, have been exceedingly popular at the gate (the Jays single season AL attendance record was just beaten yesterday by the Yankees), have been financial successes and have won the world series.
Add to this that Gillick is a good guy and a great interview.
I don't know whether you can criticize or find any fault in Gillick. I guess that his managerial career wasn't as long as some others but I would say that he has been the best GM in my lifetime.
Well I would say that Schuerholz is (or should be) a lock. What he's done in Atlanta is just incredible. I also think Gillick should get in. I mean the guy doesn't come to a place to rebuild, he comes in to win NOW. And he's done that, better than anyone else. He comes in a can right a ship pretty quick. It may be with a bunch of older guys and come at the expense of the development of the young players, but you can't argue with the results of the teams he's put together.
If only our money-grubbing ownership would have gave him the go-ahead to get one more big bat for the stretch run in 2001, we could well have won a WS...
John Hart would be closer to my GM HoF than Beane is. Beane needs quite a few more years of success before he catches Hart or Gillick, at least another two decades before he catches Schuerholz.
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by d18Mike » Mon Sep 26, 2005 11:24 am 
