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Garciaparra next year?

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Postby bleach168 » Wed Aug 31, 2005 9:05 pm

3 words,

incentive laden contract
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Postby theclefe » Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:47 pm

Big Pimpin wrote:
fantasyfiend wrote:If Nomar finishes the year strong (.315/.360/.500) and shows no lingering effects from his injury no way he will get anything less then 8 mill for another season.

He's an elite middle of the order hitter, playing one of the hardest positions to get any offense from.

either he gets a 5 yr contract in the 10-12 million range, or comes back for one more season at around the same pay to go for the 5 yr 60+ million dollar contract


I want some of whatever you're smoking man. Nomar is no longer an "elite" middle of the order hitter, and I can think of a bunch of guys who play SS who I'd rather have. Let's see: Tejada, Young, Peralta, Crosby, Lopez, Furcal, Rollins, Reyes... Not all of them could be considered "middle of the order hitters," but I don't think Nomar's worth anywhere near Tejada money. You're crazy.


Peralta, Crosby, Lopez, Furcal, Rollins, Reyes :-t

Nomar will be just as, if not more productive than the first three if healthy.

As for the other three, I don't like stolen base guys. A power guy can help with 3-4 categories while a speedster will guarentee you one. Not a sound investment for me. Plus, Rollins and Furcal are streaky as heck. :-o

You're right, Nomar is not an elite middle of the order guy anymore, nor does he deserve to be paid as one. But lets not put guys like Lopez ahead of him because of one decent season.
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Postby Big Pimpin » Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:57 pm

theclefe wrote:
Big Pimpin wrote:
fantasyfiend wrote:If Nomar finishes the year strong (.315/.360/.500) and shows no lingering effects from his injury no way he will get anything less then 8 mill for another season.

He's an elite middle of the order hitter, playing one of the hardest positions to get any offense from.

either he gets a 5 yr contract in the 10-12 million range, or comes back for one more season at around the same pay to go for the 5 yr 60+ million dollar contract


I want some of whatever you're smoking man. Nomar is no longer an "elite" middle of the order hitter, and I can think of a bunch of guys who play SS who I'd rather have. Let's see: Tejada, Young, Peralta, Crosby, Lopez, Furcal, Rollins, Reyes... Not all of them could be considered "middle of the order hitters," but I don't think Nomar's worth anywhere near Tejada money. You're crazy.


Peralta, Crosby, Lopez, Furcal, Rollins, Reyes :-t

Nomar will be just as, if not more productive than the first three if healthy.

As for the other three, I don't like stolen base guys. A power guy can help with 3-4 categories while a speedster will guarentee you one. Not a sound investment for me. Plus, Rollins and Furcal are streaky as heck. :-o

You're right, Nomar is not an elite middle of the order guy anymore, nor does he deserve to be paid as one. But lets not put guys like Lopez ahead of him because of one decent season.


That's the key to the whole thing. What makes you think Nomar can stay healthy? He sure hasn't the last few years and he's getting nothing but older. The fact is I'd rather have a guy like Peralta or Lopez who is young and on the way up than Nomar who's done very little over the last couple years and can't stay on the field to save his life. I don't love SB guys either (I have Young and Peralta on my team), so you won't get any argument from me there, although a lot of people do look to their MI guys to get some SBs.

I would be more than happy to let someone grab Nomar and then take a guy like Peralta or Lopez later on. I wouldn't touch Nomar with a ten foot pole.
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Postby theclefe » Thu Sep 01, 2005 10:28 pm

Big Pimpin wrote:
theclefe wrote:
Big Pimpin wrote:
fantasyfiend wrote:If Nomar finishes the year strong (.315/.360/.500) and shows no lingering effects from his injury no way he will get anything less then 8 mill for another season.

He's an elite middle of the order hitter, playing one of the hardest positions to get any offense from.

either he gets a 5 yr contract in the 10-12 million range, or comes back for one more season at around the same pay to go for the 5 yr 60+ million dollar contract


I want some of whatever you're smoking man. Nomar is no longer an "elite" middle of the order hitter, and I can think of a bunch of guys who play SS who I'd rather have. Let's see: Tejada, Young, Peralta, Crosby, Lopez, Furcal, Rollins, Reyes... Not all of them could be considered "middle of the order hitters," but I don't think Nomar's worth anywhere near Tejada money. You're crazy.


Peralta, Crosby, Lopez, Furcal, Rollins, Reyes :-t

Nomar will be just as, if not more productive than the first three if healthy.

As for the other three, I don't like stolen base guys. A power guy can help with 3-4 categories while a speedster will guarentee you one. Not a sound investment for me. Plus, Rollins and Furcal are streaky as heck. :-o

You're right, Nomar is not an elite middle of the order guy anymore, nor does he deserve to be paid as one. But lets not put guys like Lopez ahead of him because of one decent season.


That's the key to the whole thing. What makes you think Nomar can stay healthy? He sure hasn't the last few years and he's getting nothing but older. The fact is I'd rather have a guy like Peralta or Lopez who is young and on the way up than Nomar who's done very little over the last couple years and can't stay on the field to save his life. I don't love SB guys either (I have Young and Peralta on my team), so you won't get any argument from me there, although a lot of people do look to their MI guys to get some SBs.

I would be more than happy to let someone grab Nomar and then take a guy like Peralta or Lopez later on. I wouldn't touch Nomar with a ten foot pole.


True. He is a high risk/reward, but I would still take him over Peralta and Lopez if the three of them were sitting there. For me, I will always take a proven producer over guys who have unexpected break-out years. I think he can still play at a high level, and if/when he gets injured, just hope you find the next SS having a career year.

To take either, I would have to assume they will hit at least 20 HR, 75 runs/rbi and bat above .280 at minnimum, and I am not sold that both will do that next year.


I guess if MI is someones source for SB, then those guys are as good as any. Lord knows Peirre, podsednick and Crawford haven't been the most consistent of players. :-o
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Postby RAmst23 » Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:03 pm

I think Furcal entering the market this offseason will be huge. Hardly any team in baseball wouldn't want this guy..

If fantasy managers were running MLB, then I think Nomar would get a 5 million dollar a year contract. But we aren't, and he won't. Nomar is going to get a big deal because he's produced before, and there will be teams willing to give him the 8 million. I don't think there's anyway Nomar walks away with a contract this offseason getting only 5 million a year, unless he somehow turns nice and accepts an incentive laden deal.
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Postby Lofunzo » Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:39 pm

I highly doubt that they show any interest towards Nomar. I can really see them going after Furcal, though.
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Postby Big Pimpin » Fri Sep 02, 2005 1:01 am

theclefe wrote:True. He is a high risk/reward, but I would still take him over Peralta and Lopez if the three of them were sitting there. For me, I will always take a proven producer over guys who have unexpected break-out years. I think he can still play at a high level, and if/when he gets injured, just hope you find the next SS having a career year.

To take either, I would have to assume they will hit at least 20 HR, 75 runs/rbi and bat above .280 at minnimum, and I am not sold that both will do that next year.


I'd take Peralta over Nomar, easy. Peralta is 23 years old, in his first full season in the bigs, hits third in a young lineup that's only getting better, and has put up .295, 20 HRs, and 65 RBIs (while batting ninth for much of the year). He's only going to get better IMO. Nomar is on the way down, hasn't stayed healthy in a few years, and is nowhere near as productive as he once was when he is healthy. Maybe it's just me, but I wouldn't touch Nomar anymore. I'll let someone else deal with that headache.
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Postby Pedantic » Fri Sep 02, 2005 7:26 pm

Furcal is immensely overrated in real life. He is not a good leadoff hitter, and I would bet he throws away as many runs as he saves. A healthy Nomar is far better with the bat. If my team needed a shortstop, I'd want them to go for Nomar. You can't control injuries. Who's to say that Furcal doesn't sit out most of next year and Nomar doesn't play a full season? Remember that Furcal isn't exactly 100% right now and may not be next year either.
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Postby Lofunzo » Fri Sep 02, 2005 7:33 pm

Pedantic wrote:Furcal is immensely overrated in real life. He is not a good leadoff hitter, and I would bet he throws away as many runs as he saves. A healthy Nomar is far better with the bat. If my team needed a shortstop, I'd want them to go for Nomar. You can't control injuries. Who's to say that Furcal doesn't sit out most of next year and Nomar doesn't play a full season? Remember that Furcal isn't exactly 100% right now and may not be next year either.


With that logic, who says that Pujols won't hit .230 next year with 12 HR?? ;-7 Going back to the past 4 years for more of a sample, Furcal has played in 94% of Atlanta's games during that span while Nomar has played in 69%.
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Postby moneybaseball » Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:19 pm

Next year perdicted top ten 5 x 5:

Young
Tejada

Rollins
Furcal
Jeter
Nomar
Renteria

Crosby
Peralta
Lugo

As of this point in time I see only marginal difference between the middle five. If I was looking for more SB I'd look toward Rollins and Furcal. More roundedness, Jeter and Renteria. For AVG, HR and RBI I favor Nomar but will be listening closely to his health related issues.
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