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Chacon to the Yanks

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Postby blankman » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:04 pm

davidmarver wrote:
blankman wrote:
davidmarver wrote:
blankman wrote:
The Miner Part 2 wrote:wow. al leiter, hideo nomo, shaun chacon and maybe even randy winn! awsome job yanks brass! :-t


What else are they going to do? They don't want to trade away the future and who in their right mind could imagine a team lossing 4 of 6 original starters to the DL?

RJ was hurt
Pavano is hurt
Wang is hurt
Brown is hurt
Wright is hurt
even Sean Henn is hurt

Mussina has been the only guy that's been ok healthwise. Losing 67% of your starting staff for a long time is not something any team plans for.

Peavy was hurt, Woody was hurt, Eaton is hurt, Redding was/is hurt, May was hurt...it happens to plenty of teams. I agree that they can't trade away the future, but I have a feeling that a lot of Yankees prospects are overrated.


Um, there's a huge difference between the 15 day DL and what has happened to the Yankees. Brown's career may be over; Wang could need rotator cuff surgery putting him out for the year, Wright has been out all season and doesn't figure to be back again for a long time. Pavano has been out far longer than his 15 days. That's 4 guys out, 5 if you count Henn who was the next option all at the same time.

Please don't insult everyone's intelligence by comparing the Pad's starting injuries to the Yankees'.

Eaton has been out for quite awhile. The loss of him to the Padres is much more than the loss of Pavano to the Yankees. Few Yankees fans even wanted Brown around so it's hard to complain about his injury. Wang has missed around 4-5 starts, Woody has missed 5. Both teams' staffs have been in shambles.


Riiiiggghtttt.

Your homerism never ceases to amaze.

Do you not realize that Brown and Wang are likely out for the entire year now? Wright has been out all season, but I guess he doesn't count for anything :-?
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Postby The Miner Part 2 » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:06 pm

blankman wrote:
Do you not realize that Brown and Wang are likely out for the entire year now? Wright has been out all season, but I guess he doesn't count for anything :-?


if brown and wright would have been playing all year you guys would probably be worse off than you are now.
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Postby blankman » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:06 pm

BronXBombers51 wrote:
blankman wrote:
BronXBombers51 wrote:is this joke official or what? cuz im on the verge of strangling someone :-P


At this point with the staff the way it is, I don't much care what pitcher they trade for provided they give up nothing.

No one is going to make them better if you're not willing to give up anything good and the Yanks aren't willing to trade the future now, something they should actually be commended for.

Beggars (due to massive injuries) can't be choosers.


You might as well start frigin Nomo until the end of the season because hes better than Chacon. you would the think the Yankkes could get somebody better than that piece of garbage. really it isnt hard to find something bette than him. and lets just tack on another 3 million in salary, who gives a damn? just another overpiad piece of trash who will be lucky to have and era under 5. :-t :-P


Dude, I'm just as frustrated as you are, but I realize that when you are willing to give up nothing, all you can get is nothing in return; thats all the team is doing now.
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Postby TheYanks04 » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:08 pm

Chacon is beter than Nomo and probably better than Leiter. Not saying he will be serviceable, but he at least might be. Has has pitched OK in the past. We are not going to get Santana from the bargain bin as someone has already mentioned. Looks like he cost nect to nothing, so maybe he can buy us a few wins.
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Postby BronXBombers51 » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:09 pm

I dug this up in the first Chacon to Yanks thread a few weeks ago:

I wrote:Let me get this out of the way now, before somebody tells me he'll get better when he moves out of Coors.

Shawn Chacon 3 year splits:

Home:
162.1 IP
11-12
18 Saves (23 Opps)
5.82 ERA
.271 OBA

Away:
157.1 IP
6-16
17 Saves (21 Opps)
5.21 ERA
.246 OBA

Not to mention he's making 2.35 million.


The guy is so terrible. I want to punch someone in the face just thinking about this trade happening.


Just in case someone wanted to make that argument, let me cut you off at the pass. :-t
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Postby davidmarver » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:11 pm

blankman wrote:
davidmarver wrote:
blankman wrote:
davidmarver wrote:
blankman wrote:
The Miner Part 2 wrote:wow. al leiter, hideo nomo, shaun chacon and maybe even randy winn! awsome job yanks brass! :-t


What else are they going to do? They don't want to trade away the future and who in their right mind could imagine a team lossing 4 of 6 original starters to the DL?

RJ was hurt
Pavano is hurt
Wang is hurt
Brown is hurt
Wright is hurt
even Sean Henn is hurt

Mussina has been the only guy that's been ok healthwise. Losing 67% of your starting staff for a long time is not something any team plans for.

Peavy was hurt, Woody was hurt, Eaton is hurt, Redding was/is hurt, May was hurt...it happens to plenty of teams. I agree that they can't trade away the future, but I have a feeling that a lot of Yankees prospects are overrated.


Um, there's a huge difference between the 15 day DL and what has happened to the Yankees. Brown's career may be over; Wang could need rotator cuff surgery putting him out for the year, Wright has been out all season and doesn't figure to be back again for a long time. Pavano has been out far longer than his 15 days. That's 4 guys out, 5 if you count Henn who was the next option all at the same time.

Please don't insult everyone's intelligence by comparing the Pad's starting injuries to the Yankees'.

Eaton has been out for quite awhile. The loss of him to the Padres is much more than the loss of Pavano to the Yankees. Few Yankees fans even wanted Brown around so it's hard to complain about his injury. Wang has missed around 4-5 starts, Woody has missed 5. Both teams' staffs have been in shambles.


Riiiiggghtttt.

Your homerism never ceases to amaze.

Do you not realize that Brown and Wang are likely out for the entire year now? Wright has been out all season, but I guess he doesn't count for anything :-?

It's homerism for me, a Padres fan, to compare my Padres injuries to the Yankees, but it isn't homerism when you, a Yankees fan, say the Padres injuries aren't like the Yankees.

To use your vocabulary: riiiiggghtttt.

Eaton is more important to the Padres than Pavano is the Yankees. Woody's missed starts to the Padres are the equivalent of Wang's to the Yankees (both are big parts of the rotation). Peavy missed a start and played hurt/sick through a few more...you guys didn't even want Brown pitching so that couldn't be that crippling to the Yankees. Look, you said it's hard to imagine a team losing four of its six starters to injuries and I showed you the Padres have had that many pitchers injured this season.
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Postby nsulham » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:11 pm

blankman wrote:No one is going to make them better if you're not willing to give up anything good and the Yanks aren't willing to trade the future now, something they should actually be commended for.


Nice to hear a voice of reason for a change. If they don't give up Cano, Duncan, Hughes, whoever else, they're not getting anyone of good caliber. Plain and simple. I think the tendency of some fans is to think, because of history, that they can trade off their lower talent prospects and get quality in return but GM's are starting to wise up. No rabbits pulled out of the hat this year and it's probably what's best for their future.
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Postby TheYanks04 » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:12 pm

I do not wan tto go about defending Chacon...he blows. But in fairness, teh ROxs trying him as a closer really messed him up and he was SOOOO bad that year it skews the numbers. I think in fairness you have to throw that year's numbers out and stick with the numbers as a starter. I have no dount they blow, but have to look better with the closing numbers removed.
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Postby nsulham » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:14 pm

FWIW the Sox will also be without 4 of their starters at some point or another this season depending on what happens with Clement. Schilling, Wells, Miller and now Clement. The lengths might not be the same as the Yanks or Pads but they were still without the 4 of them at different points.
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Postby BronXBombers51 » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:14 pm

nsulham wrote:
blankman wrote:No one is going to make them better if you're not willing to give up anything good and the Yanks aren't willing to trade the future now, something they should actually be commended for.


Nice to hear a voice of reason for a change. If they don't give up Cano, Duncan, Hughes, whoever else, they're not getting anyone of good caliber. Plain and simple. I think the tendency of some fans is to think, because of history, that they can trade off their lower talent prospects and get quality in return but GM's are starting to wise up. No rabbits pulled out of the hat this year and it's probably what's best for their future.


I don't argue with that but why even attempt to get Chacon? It's like signing Nomo, just compiling a crapload of crap. There are ways to go about getting underpriced talent, Billy Beane does it everyday of his life. Everyone in the Yankee FO is too dumb to get it done though.
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