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Postby Yoda » Thu Jul 14, 2005 7:41 pm

Laean wrote:
Yoda wrote:
Laean wrote:
Yoda wrote:
Laean wrote:wasn't he basically a 20 20 type player in oakland? getting out of there means more stolen bases, and colorado means more homers ... so i don't see why he's only a borderline crap OF etc. i'd take a 25 25 player - which seems like a definite possibility. i know he hasn't been doing well this year, but keep in mind he hasn't been getting full playing time in oakland and the Athletics as a team has been sucking the first couple of months.

i'm not saying he WILL be a 25+ 25+ player, but i just look at what coors did to castilla, and burnitz to a lesser extent last year, and think he's a big - not just a borderline - potential breakout player rest of this season.


Just b/c a guy hits 20 HR one year and steals 17 bags doesn't make him a 20-20 player.

He only has 3 years of MLB experience and he's already 30. He's marginal talent and I can't see him making a big impact unless you are in a large league.


true, i should've specified last year he was almost a 20 20 player. as for him being a marginal talent, i just look at vinny castilla and see what he managed to do in coors and what he does off of it, and think even a marginal talent player can be great in colorado. here are his numbers when he played a full season:

Code: Select all
1995 COL    32 90  .309
1996 COL    40 113 .304
1997 COL    40 113 .304
1998 COL    46 144 .319
1999 COL    33 102 .275
2001 TB/HOU 25 98  .260
2002 ATL    12 61  .232
2003 ATL    22 76  .277
2004 COL    35 131 .271
2005 WAS    6  42  .253


Dude, just b/c a lot of marginal players have done well there doesn't mean that Byrnes will automatically be successful. You have no idea how he will do and neither do I. He may be worth a bench spot but until he produces, he is nothing but a waiver fodder which is what he's been in his entire career except for maybe 04.


dude, calm down, i agree with you. i never said he WILL be good. i said there's a possibility that he will be good. but just as i can't be certain and proclaim that he will be a 25+ 25+ player in colorado, you can't claim that his value is waiver fodder. if you value players the bare minimum until they've proven themselves, you're going to be late on the sleeper/breakout pickups almost all the time.

good job ignoring the stats.


Ignoring stats? Your bs Castilla/Byrnes comparison? That's really relevant.
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Postby thehat » Thu Jul 14, 2005 7:47 pm

slappinSingles wrote:
The Guru wrote:Would dropping Nick Johnson for him be wise?


Are you serious?

I wouldn't do it, but if you're in dire need of SBs, maybe.


I guess I agree, but only because I don't think all that much of Byrnes. But as for Johnson, he's a guy who should have been dealt by anyone who owned him a long time ago. He hit over his head for a couple months, has below average power for a 1B, and his PT might now be compromised even when he does return from the DL, thanks to the acquisition of Wilson.
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Postby warrick95 » Thu Jul 14, 2005 8:00 pm

Yoda wrote:
Laean wrote:
Yoda wrote:
Laean wrote:
Yoda wrote:
Laean wrote:wasn't he basically a 20 20 type player in oakland? getting out of there means more stolen bases, and colorado means more homers ... so i don't see why he's only a borderline crap OF etc. i'd take a 25 25 player - which seems like a definite possibility. i know he hasn't been doing well this year, but keep in mind he hasn't been getting full playing time in oakland and the Athletics as a team has been sucking the first couple of months.

i'm not saying he WILL be a 25+ 25+ player, but i just look at what coors did to castilla, and burnitz to a lesser extent last year, and think he's a big - not just a borderline - potential breakout player rest of this season.


Just b/c a guy hits 20 HR one year and steals 17 bags doesn't make him a 20-20 player.

He only has 3 years of MLB experience and he's already 30. He's marginal talent and I can't see him making a big impact unless you are in a large league.


true, i should've specified last year he was almost a 20 20 player. as for him being a marginal talent, i just look at vinny castilla and see what he managed to do in coors and what he does off of it, and think even a marginal talent player can be great in colorado. here are his numbers when he played a full season:

Code: Select all
1995 COL    32 90  .309
1996 COL    40 113 .304
1997 COL    40 113 .304
1998 COL    46 144 .319
1999 COL    33 102 .275
2001 TB/HOU 25 98  .260
2002 ATL    12 61  .232
2003 ATL    22 76  .277
2004 COL    35 131 .271
2005 WAS    6  42  .253


Dude, just b/c a lot of marginal players have done well there doesn't mean that Byrnes will automatically be successful. You have no idea how he will do and neither do I. He may be worth a bench spot but until he produces, he is nothing but a waiver fodder which is what he's been in his entire career except for maybe 04.


dude, calm down, i agree with you. i never said he WILL be good. i said there's a possibility that he will be good. but just as i can't be certain and proclaim that he will be a 25+ 25+ player in colorado, you can't claim that his value is waiver fodder. if you value players the bare minimum until they've proven themselves, you're going to be late on the sleeper/breakout pickups almost all the time.

good job ignoring the stats.


Ignoring stats? Your bs Castilla/Byrnes comparison? That's really relevant.


His valid point is that Coors' Field is the best hitters' park in the league and inflates numbers. Chances are, Byrnes' numbers will become inflated, too. To what degree is the question.
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Postby The Miner Part 2 » Thu Jul 14, 2005 8:19 pm

i just dropped him for the farns. B-)
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Postby Cleveland Steamers » Thu Jul 14, 2005 8:25 pm

Coors doesnt make a player like Byrnes a stud. Even if Coors adds 15-20 points on his BA and 5 HR, this doesnt make Byrnes an automatic guy to sign. If youre in a deep league, I can see it but if your in a league with 12 teams or less...players of Byrnes quality are all over waivers, and Im talking after he is hitting in Coors. The Preston Wilson drop for Byrnes isnt a huge deal since neither are exceptionally valuable.
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Postby stevethumb » Thu Jul 14, 2005 9:10 pm

warrick95 wrote:IMO, he's worth using as a platoon player. I dropped Preston Wilson for him myself. I think he'll put up near-Matt Holliday numbers, which is decent enough.
...just what i posted on another site...expect matt holliday #s
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Postby Yoda » Thu Jul 14, 2005 9:15 pm

stevethumb wrote:
warrick95 wrote:IMO, he's worth using as a platoon player. I dropped Preston Wilson for him myself. I think he'll put up near-Matt Holliday numbers, which is decent enough.
...just what i posted on another site...expect matt holliday #s


Matt Holliday is a borderline waiver fodder. So what is the argument again?
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Postby baseballnewb » Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:29 pm

If you don't think a move to coors greatly improves a hitters value you are just clueless about fantasy baseball. Sure byrnes may not explode and be a stud, but he should be snapped up in every league and at least used on home heavy weeks until he proves that he's the 1% of hitters that do not explode when moving to coors.
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Postby Laean » Fri Jul 15, 2005 4:12 am

Yoda wrote:
Laean wrote:
Yoda wrote:
Laean wrote:
Yoda wrote:
Laean wrote:wasn't he basically a 20 20 type player in oakland? getting out of there means more stolen bases, and colorado means more homers ... so i don't see why he's only a borderline crap OF etc. i'd take a 25 25 player - which seems like a definite possibility. i know he hasn't been doing well this year, but keep in mind he hasn't been getting full playing time in oakland and the Athletics as a team has been sucking the first couple of months.

i'm not saying he WILL be a 25+ 25+ player, but i just look at what coors did to castilla, and burnitz to a lesser extent last year, and think he's a big - not just a borderline - potential breakout player rest of this season.


Just b/c a guy hits 20 HR one year and steals 17 bags doesn't make him a 20-20 player.

He only has 3 years of MLB experience and he's already 30. He's marginal talent and I can't see him making a big impact unless you are in a large league.


true, i should've specified last year he was almost a 20 20 player. as for him being a marginal talent, i just look at vinny castilla and see what he managed to do in coors and what he does off of it, and think even a marginal talent player can be great in colorado. here are his numbers when he played a full season:

Code: Select all
1995 COL    32 90  .309
1996 COL    40 113 .304
1997 COL    40 113 .304
1998 COL    46 144 .319
1999 COL    33 102 .275
2001 TB/HOU 25 98  .260
2002 ATL    12 61  .232
2003 ATL    22 76  .277
2004 COL    35 131 .271
2005 WAS    6  42  .253


Dude, just b/c a lot of marginal players have done well there doesn't mean that Byrnes will automatically be successful. You have no idea how he will do and neither do I. He may be worth a bench spot but until he produces, he is nothing but a waiver fodder which is what he's been in his entire career except for maybe 04.


dude, calm down, i agree with you. i never said he WILL be good. i said there's a possibility that he will be good. but just as i can't be certain and proclaim that he will be a 25+ 25+ player in colorado, you can't claim that his value is waiver fodder. if you value players the bare minimum until they've proven themselves, you're going to be late on the sleeper/breakout pickups almost all the time.

good job ignoring the stats.


Ignoring stats? Your bs Castilla/Byrnes comparison? That's really relevant.


why in the world is it bs? castilla = "marginal player" (your words), byrnes also = a marginal player. at coors castilla = awesome, away = suck. byrnes away coors = suck, at coors might = pretty good. it's not like i made up those stats ... so i don't get why they're bs.
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Postby Registered_Guest » Fri Jul 15, 2005 4:16 am

Byrnes in Colorado should be a decent #3 OF and very good #4 OF in a 12-team league.
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