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i dropped bartolo colon...

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i dropped bartolo colon...

Postby sinicalypse » Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:11 am

i finally had to let him go. my staff is pretty killer... prior, mulder, wolf, dontrelle willis, brett myers... and i took a chance with johan santana. sure, i think colon is a solid pitcher capable of doing pretty well... but with the white sox being rather .500ish and lifeless out there.. bartolo seems to have slipped back into his somewhat apathetic pre-2002 ways... mid to upper 3 ERA pitcher, records like 13-10, 15-12, etc... thing is, i think he's still got a month or two on his white sox sentence... and when he gets out, he might be in too much of an apathetic groove to really turn it on and pitch 10-2 / 2.50 era ball for the last month or two... since losses count against me in the league, i figured it was time to amiably part ways...

so what do you guys think? is colon still sitting on a 10-2ish stretch with a good era, or is he pretty much going to coast through the season, end up like 12-9 with a 3.75 era, and still collect like 7 million a year when he gets a contract after the season?
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Postby YankFan51 » Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:11 am

ugh, I'd have dropped a Willis or Myers before Colon. Look what Colon did tonite
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Postby sinicalypse » Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:17 am

yeah i saw that... santana basically matched him. i'm looking over the semi-long term... and right now, i'd MUCH rather have dontrelle willis than bartolo colon. i think he's poised to be a much better fantasy # producer than colon over the rest of the season.
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Postby YankFan51 » Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:18 am

I just traded Willis for Washburn. I'd rather go with the proven guys than the unproven, especially rookies
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Postby sinicalypse » Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:26 am

that's generally a good strategy... but sometimes i just get a feeling about some kids. in '01 it was a guy named mulder. in '02 it was padilla, mainly early on i nthe season... and well, while mulder is almost a lock to be a stud, i have dontrelle willis pegged a tier or two below him. another lefty ,a very deceptive kevin brownish delivery... he's got some horsepower o nthat fastball, and some pretty nasty movement on the breaking stuff, he seems to be able to strike out more guys than mulder... so if he can pitch like he did against the A's last time out, induce a bunch of ground balls... welp, i think the sky's the limit for this kid too. i could see him going 13-5 with a 3.5 era and a heap of strikeouts, maybe averaging out to 6-7 per start.

i really think he'll end up having a better fantasy season than bartolo. only time will tell
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Postby jdh » Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:39 am

Dropping Bartolo Colon while keeping Willis and even Santana on your squad is completely idiotic and I highly suggest you get him back before someone else grabs him. You do realize that Willis has only a couple of starts of MLB experience and that likely the primary reason for his success is his unusual delivery and that players have not seen him yet. Now that he has played more games, scouting reports will get out as to how to beat him and how to hit him, and he will almost probably start getting it handed to him the second go around. Rookie starters are especially risky because they are prone to meltdowns at any time and there are very few examples of rookie pitchers who have immeadiately come in and been able to maintain dominance from the moment they debut. Kerry Wood and Dwight Gooden are two examples I can think of, but they are exceptions and not the rule. Trust me, Willis will come down to earth and it won't be pretty. Rookies also tend to wear down as the innings counts mount, so look for a drop off later in the year.

Santana is a better pitcher than Willis and has awesome stuff, but you can't keep him and dump Colon, because there is no guarantee he even gets a fulltime roster spot this year. The Twins seem to like the idea of having a strong bullpen, so he might be nothing more than a spot starter.

Colon is a proven commodity, and a durable 200 innings guy. Yes, he will likely have an ERA in the high 3.00 range but should win lots of games, especially when the Sox offense starts producing, which they eventually will. Going with promising waiver wire flash in the pans over proven top 20 starters is just plain idiotic, and will hurt you in the end. At the very least, trade Colon and get some value for him, you can't drop a guy like that outright.
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Postby sinicalypse » Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:49 am

dropping mark prior, woody williams, javier vazquez, schilling, randy johnson, pedro, zito, mulder, matt morris, oswalt, etc... thats idiotic. but bartolo colon?

other than last season, sure bartolo had a 18-5 season once with an era a hair under 4... but in this league, i'm basically liking my chances to run away with the wins crown... i'm up 6 and you can see my staff out there. i'm concerned about losses and ERA, not t omention strikeouts... and i'm over my innings limit.

sure, it's risky to sit on a dontrelle willis, and even brett myers in the wake of what i just said... but it's far from idiotic. what did bartolo do for hte last 3-4 starts before tonight? i don't think he's going to win more than 12 or 13 games this season, and well, again, dontrelle willis has pretty damn good odds to become a better pitcher than colon, i nmy humble opinoon.

i wouldn't have even replied... but this is like the third or 4th "i dropped so and so" message i posted where you called the move idiocy and proceeded to go on about proven commodities. but hey, thanks for the brutal honesty. just be sure t olet me know when you make a borderline move so i can weigh in =)
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Postby jdh » Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:54 am

Colon is not that far below the level of a Prior, Oswalt, or Vazquez in terms of overall value. If you really don't like him, you should trade him away and get another pitcher or package him with an outfielder to get a better outfielder or something, but I am going to stand by my words. Dropping a proven pitcher, who won 20 games last year and has decent trade value instead of getting something of value for him is just plain braindead unless this is a 4 team league.

To give you an idea of Colon's trade value, I got Mulder for him at the beginning of the year. Granted, he hasn't lit the world on fire so far, but you still can get either another decent pitcher or a decent upgrade at some position for him, don't give him away for free.
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Postby Lepke » Sun Jun 08, 2003 3:49 am

Love the strategy sinicalypse. ;-D

It's moves like that, that will make or break your fantasy season and quite frankly it's nice to see someon have the balls to pull something like that.

You all wont be calling him an idiot when Willis out-produces Colon for the rest of the reason.*

*You all will be calling him an idiot when Colon out-produces Willis for the rest of the season.

I hope the move works out for you. Gutsy performance.
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Postby Madison » Sun Jun 08, 2003 4:05 am

I would have traded Colon rather than dropping him. I've had inquiries all year about what I want for him. Some of the offers have actually been quite good. He's on pace right now to win 18 games which isn't too bad either. Just think how many he will win when the Sox bats wake up.

I'm not going to tell you it was wrong to drop him, but I would not have done it. He is too valuable to just drop. I'd have traded him.
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